• Amused
  • Angry
  • Annoyed
  • Awesome
  • Bemused
  • Cocky
  • Cool
  • Crazy
  • Crying
  • Depressed
  • Down
  • Drunk
  • Embarrased
  • Enraged
  • Friendly
  • Geeky
  • Godly
  • Happy
  • Hateful
  • Hungry
  • Innocent
  • Meh
  • Piratey
  • Poorly
  • Sad
  • Secret
  • Shy
  • Sneaky
  • Tired
  • Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
    Results 21 to 37 of 37

    Thread: genetic observations

    1. #21
      wayne1's Avatar
      wayne1 is offline Supporting Member
      is Old boy
       
      Feeling:
      Cool
       
      Join Date
      May 2011
      Location
      The Gower SOUTH WALES UK
      Posts
      1,392
      very nice parent fish ! and yearlings and anybody who says long fins are not koi are silly as its just another great type of koi ! the only disadvantage is in cooler northern countrys were we have cold weather in winter that may affect the fin's but keeping them indoors in winter is a good option or heating !.
      we don'y see many good ones here in the uk but I have seen some nice all black ones back in the early 90's ,but I will try and breed a long fin Ki shusui if i can buy a good shusui type ! .
      another breeding project for 2014 !lol !.

    2. #22
      Billy Pounds is offline Senior Member
      This user has no status.
       
      Feeling:
      ----
       
      Join Date
      Sep 2010
      Location
      Memphis Tn
      Posts
      1,389
      The only genetic study I have ever really seen was in a TFH publication called KOI VARIETIES JAPANESE COLORED CARP by Herbert Axelrod...it is a punnett square{alleles}study of scalation patterns...leather, striped German, Doitsu and wagoi...just looked on Amazon...2 new copies and 30+ used copies for sale as of today..maybe if you search for a pdf there is one somewhere....Billy
      Last edited by Billy Pounds; 03-27-2013 at 12:51 PM.

    3. #23
      Billy Pounds is offline Senior Member
      This user has no status.
       
      Feeling:
      ----
       
      Join Date
      Sep 2010
      Location
      Memphis Tn
      Posts
      1,389
      http://books.google.com/books?id=dMb..._cloud_r&cad=5 here is the link to the genetics part of this book

    4. #24
      wayne1's Avatar
      wayne1 is offline Supporting Member
      is Old boy
       
      Feeling:
      Cool
       
      Join Date
      May 2011
      Location
      The Gower SOUTH WALES UK
      Posts
      1,392
      this is a great book ! he tried to breed minature koi 5inches max size way back in the seventies ! on a florida fish farm ! but when bred they reverted back to normal size koi !
      Amazing guy ! and a great passion for fish keeping of all types including koi so a great read to any hobbist wishing to learn more about koi breeding !.

    5. #25
      Jag is offline Senior Member
      This user has no status.
       
      Feeling:
      ----
       
      Join Date
      Mar 2013
      Location
      Western Australia
      Posts
      361
      Quote Originally Posted by RickF View Post
      Actually, I think you just proved that gin rin is dominate. ...
      Agree with RickF - You have established that gin rin is dominant. If the gin rin gene was recessive then you would have had all gin rin!

      So what it means is that some of your parent fish could have 2 x Dominant gin rin genes and some (if not all) definitely have 1 x Dominant and 1 x recessive non-gin rin gene... however you don't know which parent is carrying what

      A mendelian checkerboard would explain dominant/recessive probability better than I could

    6. #26
      Billy Pounds is offline Senior Member
      This user has no status.
       
      Feeling:
      ----
       
      Join Date
      Sep 2010
      Location
      Memphis Tn
      Posts
      1,389
      The Axelrod book was my second book on Koi...Cult of the Koi was my first....anything that is a cult has to be good, right???LOL...I would really like an updated book on the potential for koi genetics as far as conformation, coloration, and skin quality....I have read that you can breed for specifics and that you can't breed for specific traits....it will be a journey in enrichment when I get my fish to breed again that I don't kill all the babies at once from inexperience...I really enjoy reading your posts Wayne...your breeding expertise is very much appreciated. There is an operation in North Mississippi about 90 miles from my home that breeds koi and other carp for KHV and SVC, etc research....it is run by the state and from what I gathered from talking to some people, it is being managed with the intention of developing something to kill some of these darn "flying carp"...since Mississippi is where most of the non-native population escaped from due to flooding catfish farms to start appearing in other estuaries and tributaries....they have discussed the ramifications on the native carp population if they do turn KHV infected fish loose in the rivers...it will be a crap shoot in my eyes as some fish will become more resistant to the disease over a period of time while a major portion of the native fish get wiped out...people playing genetic mad scientist-Creator/Destroyer can present it's own problems

    7. #27
      wayne1's Avatar
      wayne1 is offline Supporting Member
      is Old boy
       
      Feeling:
      Cool
       
      Join Date
      May 2011
      Location
      The Gower SOUTH WALES UK
      Posts
      1,392
      Hi Allinkdup
      Well Im no expert but just tell it as what i have learnt over 38 years from practical experiance and working on fish farms as a helper ,there are genetic programes that can be placed in the Mississippi like they did in Austrailia with adding fish that will only produce male fish !,but been a very large area and river system I would expect it to take quite a few years to happen but how that one worked out I don't suspect it worked out to well ,but somebody may know !.
      as for the jumping Carp helmet's on at all time's ,saw the discovery channel programe a few years back and it was amazing how they have populated a massive area in no time at all
      it just shows you how things can get out of hand with man's intervention ,and because they eat toxic algae they cant be eaten either so a big problem !.and now with this new KHV only brings more problems and like you say wiping out the native fish at the same time !,when will we get it right !.
      Last edited by wayne1; 03-31-2013 at 04:12 AM.

    8. #28
      Billy Pounds is offline Senior Member
      This user has no status.
       
      Feeling:
      ----
       
      Join Date
      Sep 2010
      Location
      Memphis Tn
      Posts
      1,389
      ROTFLMAO...he said "Helmets"....for fishing....hehe....I have actually seen people trading recipes for them at a fish fry....and, NO!....we were eating catfish....Billy
      Last edited by Billy Pounds; 03-29-2013 at 01:55 PM.

    9. #29
      wayne1's Avatar
      wayne1 is offline Supporting Member
      is Old boy
       
      Feeling:
      Cool
       
      Join Date
      May 2011
      Location
      The Gower SOUTH WALES UK
      Posts
      1,392
      Yes just need some spikes attatched and you could just sit in the boat and head harpoon them lol !!!.
      I wonder when young they would be like whitebait ! deep fryed till golden brown and crispy ! lemon salt and black cracked pepper !yum yumy !

    10. #30
      Billy Pounds is offline Senior Member
      This user has no status.
       
      Feeling:
      ----
       
      Join Date
      Sep 2010
      Location
      Memphis Tn
      Posts
      1,389
      I'm wondering about incorporating them back into some fish food...they are supposedly as oily as whitefish

    11. #31
      wayne1's Avatar
      wayne1 is offline Supporting Member
      is Old boy
       
      Feeling:
      Cool
       
      Join Date
      May 2011
      Location
      The Gower SOUTH WALES UK
      Posts
      1,392
      Sounds good must have a good omega 3 ! sorry K4u2c were getting off track here ! how's the long fin's doing ! and how are the gin rin ones ! I love them !.

    12. #32
      koi4u2c is offline Senior Member
      This user has no status.
       
      Feeling:
      ----
       
      Join Date
      Feb 2005
      Location
      Southeast Virginia
      Posts
      2,754
      Longfins in greenhouse covered pond are doing well. The longfins in my outdoor pond I hope are doing well. Water a little green and water temp still somewhat cool, so I only see glimpses now and then.

      I may breed a few this year. I will have to see who is eggy. Most of mine are males and many females do not have eggs in spring. Something has prevented me from spawning the last couple of years, so I will have to wait and see. But I love seeing those little babies with their fluttering fins. It was easy for me to see why Randy LaFever called them butterfly koi.

    13. #33
      wayne1's Avatar
      wayne1 is offline Supporting Member
      is Old boy
       
      Feeling:
      Cool
       
      Join Date
      May 2011
      Location
      The Gower SOUTH WALES UK
      Posts
      1,392
      Hi Koi4u2c
      That's good to here they are doing ok ! and green water will do them some good ! and that would be good if you could post some pic's of the fry and how the long fins grow out from a egg on wards would be fasinating to see as I have never kept them or bred them so I might have to have a go and seek out some long fins !,I have the long fin bug !!!
      now lol !!! ,can't wait for summer !!! I love long fin shusui they look brilliant ,you just never see them here in the uk !lol I will have to change that ! and maybe have a go at long fin Ki shusui here in wales !.
      Thanks for the insperation ,love the thread ,keep the posts and pic's coming !.

    14. #34
      dalozt's Avatar
      dalozt is offline Senior Member
      This user has no status.
       
      Feeling:
      ----
       
      Join Date
      Oct 2012
      Location
      Indonesia
      Posts
      1,302
      Progression pics please.. I always love this kind of thread.. Very educational..

    15. #35
      koi4u2c is offline Senior Member
      This user has no status.
       
      Feeling:
      ----
       
      Join Date
      Feb 2005
      Location
      Southeast Virginia
      Posts
      2,754
      bump
      Nancy



    16. #36
      Hope J is online now Senior Member
      This user has no status.
       
      Feeling:
      ----
       
      Join Date
      Mar 2019
      Location
      Georgia
      Posts
      307
      Quote Originally Posted by RickF View Post
      Actually, I think you just proved that gin rin is dominate.

      If gin rin was recessive and all of the possible parents were gin rin, then none of the parents could possibly carry the gene for normal scales, so 100% of the offspring would be gin rin. If gin rin is dominant, all of the parents could carry the normal scale gene. If it is a single gene and all of the parents are heterozygotic, then you should get 75% gin rin and 25% normal scales. If some of the parents are homozygotic and some are heterogotic, then you should get more than 75% gin rin. Assuming the presence of gin rin did not influence which fry survived, it looks as if more than one gene must be involved.
      I don't know about organ deformities when it comes to Gin Rin but I did read that breeding Doitsu to Doitsu results in fry with internal organ mutations resulting in a huge mortality rate so maybe it's possible with Gin Rin too?

    17. #37
      Hope J is online now Senior Member
      This user has no status.
       
      Feeling:
      ----
       
      Join Date
      Mar 2019
      Location
      Georgia
      Posts
      307
      Beautiful fish! Lots of really deep colors!

    Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12

    Posting Permissions

    • You may not post new threads
    • You may not post replies
    • You may not post attachments
    • You may not edit your posts
    •