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  • Results 1 to 13 of 13

    Thread: Sand filter to beads conversion questions?

    1. #1
      fly4koi is offline Senior Member
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      Sand filter to beads conversion questions?

      Hello,

      In the quest of chasing crisp water, I'm looking to convert my Pentair TR40 sand filter into a glass bead filter mainly for mechanical/polishing reason.
      The problem: If I shine a light or look into the water on a sunny day, I can see particles: https://photos.app.goo.gl/F9J9KxPrRCjigQuE8

      Current filtering setup:

      T-split->Aqua Ultima 2->Pentair TR40->UV->pond
      ->Ozone->waterfall->pond

      Currently I'm bypassing the sand filter because I believe the sands are gunk up and creating too much back pressure and interferes with my biomechanical filter.
      This had create water quality issue in the past and since then my water has been stable.

      My original thought is just to replace the sand and swap in the beads
      But I talked with the vendor of permabeads (a type of glass bead) and the suggestion is to re-pipe so that TR40 is the first stage followed by the Ultima 2.

      So my questions:
      1) Any strong opinion on the order of the stages? Currently the Ultima 2 is capturing good amount of debris, but the vendor thinks it would work better by trapping the debris with TR40 first.
      2) Can I expect the water to be much better with less particles? I'm not sure if that's a realistic expectation.
      3) Any alternative to permabeads that's more economical?
      4) With TR40 sized for 4000 gal pond, would my weekly backwash routine be sufficient? In the past the sand filter clogged up the flow rate and mess with my bio so I'd like to avoid that same problem.

      Thanks in advance.
      Last edited by fly4koi; 2 Weeks Ago at 01:24 AM.

    2. #2
      fly4koi is offline Senior Member
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      So I've done some research and here's my thoughts:

      1) I figured out a way to repipe but for now I'll just keep the polishing setup to see how much fines are captured.
      2) IIRC the sand filter was plenty dirty when I backwash, I just don't like how it causes too much head pressure which reduced the flow.
      3) I opened up the filter and the sands are gunk up. I looked into zeolite/zeosand but it would release ammonia with salting, sinking plastic media is turning it into another biomechanical, so looks like perma beads are the only proven solution.
      4) I guess we'll see...

    3. #3
      BWG's Avatar
      BWG is offline Senior Member
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      For less back pressure most likey any pool sand or grit media larger than what's currently used will work. Try the chicken grit many use in SG filters.

    4. #4
      fly4koi is offline Senior Member
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      Thanks, I did order the perma beads, they are not cheap but should work really well.

    5. #5
      two_wheeled is offline Senior Member
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      @fly4koi, are you converting a pool filter? This is interesting. Please post your results. I would like to see how you did it, and how well it works.
      -Steve in Phx.
      Novice Extraordinaire

    6. #6
      fly4koi is offline Senior Member
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      The beads should arrive this weekend and might take me some time to swap the media. Yes, I'm converting a pool filter, it's not my original setup, it's just some learning in the past few years that led me to believe the sand media is not the best choice to filter out the fine particulates in the pond, and I don't necessarily want to convert it into another bio because I have already have sufficient bio.

    7. #7
      Bass0r is offline Junior Member
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      I have tried to get a hold of the perma beads people for a long time, if I may ask, what number or website did you use to get some ordered?

      TIA,

      Ken

    8. #8
      fly4koi is offline Senior Member
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      Quote Originally Posted by Bass0r View Post
      I have tried to get a hold of the perma beads people for a long time, if I may ask, what number or website did you use to get some ordered?

      TIA,

      Ken
      I believe the source is here from Dana: https://www.advancedaquaculture.com/
      but I ordered through https://www.permabeads.com/ which is also https://www.integrated-aqua.com/ and it's drop shipped out of FL.
      $230 a cu. ft. and have to order by a whole cu. ft., shipping not included.
      Last edited by fly4koi; 1 Week Ago at 12:34 AM.

    9. #9
      Bass0r is offline Junior Member
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      Thanks! I have submitted request for quote at least 2 times from the second site you linked but never got a response.

      Oh well!

      Thanks again,

      Ken

    10. #10
      fly4koi is offline Senior Member
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      Weird, I got a response very quickly. Anyhow I PM you the contact information, good luck.

    11. #11
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      The idea of having the bead in front of the ultima, allows the ultima to act more as a pure biofilter with the bead being the mechanical filtration Too bad you're not local to northern CA, I have 6-7 cubic feat of floating beads (from aqua bead I think) from when I was going to convert a sand filter. got the DE 6-way valve for upflow design, some internals, and the spa blower... then went another direction to use less energy.
      The beads are probably worth 3 times what I bought them for 20 years ago, but shipping kills all.
      Koiphen member since 05-13-2004

    12. #12
      fly4koi is offline Senior Member
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      Thank you @danzcool. The original sand filter was piped behind the Ultima to polish the water, but it clogs up too quickly and cause the flow to drop in the bio, enough to wreck the bacterial because there's a split for waterfall return before the bio, so any excessive pressure just end up sending more untreated water back to the pond. It wasn't until I bypass the sand filter then the water got more stable, so while I wish I could capture more fines I want to see how much fines it can capture and how often I need to backwash, before I can commit to swap the stages.

      Also looks like you are sitting on a gold mine of beads because gold appreciated in price by some 400% in the last 20 years and your bead are at 300%!
      Last edited by fly4koi; 1 Week Ago at 02:02 AM.

    13. #13
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      @fly4koi... yeah commodities are where it is at, just didn't think plastic would be the new gold, lol.
      Koiphen member since 05-13-2004

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