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  • Results 1 to 17 of 17

    Thread: New Koi Pond - help needed

    1. #1
      GomeZko is offline Junior Member
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      Question New Koi Pond - help needed

      Dear Koi friends,

      Im new to the Koi community, thus iīd like to discuss my first Koi pond set up with you and hopefully, i will learn something new.
      Iīm open to any ideas/critique.

      My first thought was to build a beautiful liner pond with rockīs all over it - i know i know.. :D
      After a lot of research on web, iīve decided to build a proper concrete koi pond.
      I want to do it just once and correctly as itīs pretty expensive thing to build.

      Koi Pond ideas and details (pictures included):
      I dug 6m x 3m x 2m ( L x W x D ) with a ledge for plants ( just a small layer or rocks that i will plant in. Approx: 25-30k litres of water as it will get smalled after brickīs are layed.
      I want to have 10, max 15 Koiīs in it.
      Pond will be done with reinforced concrete bottom. Wall from bricks filled with reinforced concrete. Semi-raised - water will be+/- on ground level, walls raised 15-20 cm above ground.
      It will have aerated bottom drain in the middle + wall mounted skimmer both on 4 inch pipe.

      Question: Contractor that will be selling me the equipment told me 1 is enough. Is it correct?

      Filtration:
      Gravity set up : I really like the concept of Drum filters, so i want to use one with connection to Moving bed however i donīt know which one. I think OASE has good reference but im new to this.
      Contractor told me to use Drum set from OASE : OASE Proficlear premium drum filter into OASE Moving bed ( it only has 50 literīs of Hel-x media with option to add 50 more liters ) into OASE individual filter where will be Oase Bitron Gravity 55 UVC into pump. Aeration as well.

      Question: What are your thoughtīs on this?
      Any experience with it? Should i use different moving bed or maybe compact filter?
      I was also thinking about using bead filter instead of moving bed, but i like the concept of moving bedīs.

      Clear water:
      I was thinking of having a T piece after the pump with valveīs, where one part will go to a rock waterfall near the pond with option to turn it off in case my neighbours wouldnīt like the sound at night time
      and second (major) part will go 24/7 to the pond via outlents in the wall under the water level.

      Question: Is this how waterfallīs are made when i donīt want to have a separate pump somewhere in the pond?

      Can one pump do this all? Itīs hard to set up up properly as the flow needīs to be strong enough to run waterfall + outlets, but iīve read that itīs not good for bacteria in moving bed to have too strong pump, as they wonīt have enough time to
      to clean the water. Height of waterfall will be max 1m above water level. Most probabably lower than 1m.
      In case i would use above mentioned filtration - i donīt want to buy 2 bitron UVC lights for the second minor pump.

      How many outletīs should i use?


      Thank you for your time reading all these questions
      Im happy to discuss and ideas you will have. I live in Slovakia so sorry for my english.
      Attached Images Attached Images      

    2. #2
      Grumpy's Avatar
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      Great Start! That looks like it was tough digging too. One thing you did not confirm, will you still use a liner inside the block walls?

      The "bricks" you plan to use will be the same as used in the building next to the pond? If so, I would suggest you plan on using mortar or adhesive between the bricks, or blocks, as you build your walls off the concrete slab especially if you will not fill the blocks with concrete until the walls are done. Also I would suggest embedding reinforcing steel both vertical and horizontal in the block walls, and also have reinforcing steel embedded in the concrete slab that extends vertically into the block walls.

      If you want I can provide more details of what I am suggesting, if you wish.

      Many folks on this forum will provide good help, with regard to the plumbing and filtration, and Thanks for posting your project.

    3. #3
      stevek's Avatar
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      Sometimes pics are deceiving when it comes to distances, but it looks as if the tree line is pretty close to the proposed edge of the pond. Conifers will continue to grow bigger over time, and you may have some challenges with maintenance and appearance of the trees . Blue spruce won't look right if you shear like a hedge. You always want enough clearance to be able to walk around the edges of the pond.

      Might also have some issues with tree roots causing issues down the line. I'm having some cracks in my driveway now caused be roots from 75 foot trees that are displacing dirt under the driveway as they get bigger and bigger, and are causing cracks in the asphalt.

    4. #4
      GomeZko is offline Junior Member
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      Thank you for the response,

      I forgot to mention, that the 4m long lenge at the back of the pond will actually be the filter area hidden under wooden floor. So it wonīt be that close to the trees.
      It was pretty fun digging.. for first few months.. . I started at mid september last year.. and itīs still not completely done haha.
      The pond wonīt be done from the same bricks as the building. Itīs done from a simple bricks with no concrete inside. Pond will be done from something like this. Name:  -2350182_ew370_eh370.jpg
Views: 164
Size:  49.0 KB20cm wide walls filled with concrete and reinforcement.
      Thank you for the point of embedding the reinforcment both vertically and horizontaly in the concrete slab. Will do that

      Any tips on above questions please? Iīm losing my hair trying to figure out the correct filtration haha

      Best regards,
      Miro

    5. #5
      dragonfly1976 is offline Senior Member
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      Having one bottom drain in a pond this size might work if you heavily slope the bottom to it, but I would suggest 2 bottom drains. You will be much happier with the results. It will also help you with your flow to your filtration system by pulling from 3 - 4” pipes instead of only two.
      You will also want 2 pumps for 2 circuits for a pond this size (8,000 gallons) for your turnover rate to be at least once and hour.
      Last edited by dragonfly1976; 6 Days Ago at 06:26 AM.

    6. #6
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      Thank you dragonfly1976. In this case, i would have to use 2 pumps as you mentioned - do i need to have 2x Bitronic UV light in the oase individual filter, or can I only use one on main pump (directly to the pond) and the waterfall pump would be without the UV?
      Those UVīs are too expensive in my eyes. Is there any alternative?
      Btw - will the Proficlear premium oase drum + MB filter be enought for this volume of water?
      Thank you.

    7. #7
      icu2's Avatar
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      Welcome and thanks for joining Koiphen!

      It's hard to suggest filtration equipment because we don't really know what's available to you in Slovakia. But looking at
      what a search brought up for the filter you mentioned:

      https://store.oase-usa.com/products/...MaAv4QEALw_wcB

      It said it has a single input and a total flow rate of 4000 gph. For a 30,000 liter pond (+7000 gallon) I think that's way too
      small. Compare it with some that many use here with 3 - 5 110mm inputs:

      https://www.googleadservices.com/pag...gQIDBA8&adurl=

      https://playitkoi.com/products/profi...6&currency=USD

      https://www.googleadservices.com/pag...gQIDBBS&adurl=

      I agree with dragonfly that with a 6m x 3m pond floor you should use 2 - 4" (110mm) bottom drains and one or two
      skimmers. Total flow I think should be at a minimum 30,000 lph and preferable more. So if it were mine and doing an
      RDF (rotary drum filter) I'd look for something that could flow closer to those numbers.

      Great start to your project and I look forward to watching how it comes together!
      --Steve


      “First in excellence
      frist in pride"
      --Weeds

    8. #8
      dragonfly1976 is offline Senior Member
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      Quote Originally Posted by GomeZko View Post
      Thank you dragonfly1976. In this case, i would have to use 2 pumps as you mentioned - do i need to have 2x Bitronic UV light in the oase individual filter, or can I only use one on main pump (directly to the pond) and the waterfall pump would be without the UV?
      Those UVīs are too expensive in my eyes. Is there any alternative?
      Btw - will the Proficlear premium oase drum + MB filter be enought for this volume of water?
      Thank you.
      You won’t have to buy 2 UV sterilizers for your pond. You will only need to run 1 sterilizer on one of the pond circuits returning to the pond. Just make sure you buy one with a wattage big enough to handle a 7,000-8,000 gallon pond. If you decide on a rotary drum filter, you may not need a UV sterilizer at all.

    9. #9
      GomeZko is offline Junior Member
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      Hello icu2,
      Thank you for your tips.
      Iīll be happy to use 2 BDīs + 1 Skimmer if you say itīs better - thatīs why im here to learn and listen to more experienced people
      Regarding the filter - M sized Proficlear filter would be too small. I was looking for the L size of it with flow rate of 25k liters/hour.
      Wouldnt it affect the quality of the Moving bed module filtration with that high turn over rate?
      Will 1 moving bed with 50k Hel-X media be enough?? Shouldnīt i put 2 later to ensure correct bio quality? Not sure how much more Hel-X can i add to the MB.

      Main filtration i want to use:
      RDF: https://www.oase.sk/produkt/oase-pro...er-gravity-fed
      MB: https://www.oase.sk/produkt/oase-pro...ving-bed-modul

      Best regards,
      Miro

    10. #10
      GomeZko is offline Junior Member
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      Thank you.
      You just saved me a lot of money.
      How about pumps? One line would go on the filter level to the pond under the water level - Can I use some Eco pump to save some money on the electricity bill?
      Second one would push water cca 4m far from filter + 1,5 upwards to the waterfall. This will need to be stronger probably.
      Sorry for this type of questions- im doing it for the first time. We only had small plastic pond when i was young with goldfish and always wanted to have a "real" koi pond when i get older hehe.

    11. #11
      Nguyen365's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by icu2 View Post
      Welcome and thanks for joining Koiphen!

      It's hard to suggest filtration equipment because we don't really know what's available to you in Slovakia. But looking at
      what a search brought up for the filter you mentioned:

      https://store.oase-usa.com/products/...MaAv4QEALw_wcB

      It said it has a single input and a total flow rate of 4000 gph. For a 30,000 liter pond (+7000 gallon) I think that's way too
      small. Compare it with some that many use here with 3 - 5 110mm inputs:

      https://www.googleadservices.com/pag...gQIDBA8&adurl=

      https://playitkoi.com/products/profi...5141666Īcy=USD

      https://www.googleadservices.com/pag...gQIDBBS&adurl=

      I agree with dragonfly that with a 6m x 3m pond floor you should use 2 - 4" (110mm) bottom drains and one or two
      skimmers. Total flow I think should be at a minimum 30,000 lph and preferable more. So if it were mine and doing an
      RDF (rotary drum filter) I'd look for something that could flow closer to those numbers.

      Great start to your project and I look forward to watching how it comes together!
      https://playitkoi.com/products/profi...6&currency=USD. Gets my vote. Has rdf and moving bed all in one for $5700. Plus later you can add shower ontop of unit if you wanted more bio.

    12. #12
      icu2's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by GomeZko View Post
      Hello icu2,
      Thank you for your tips.
      Iīll be happy to use 2 BDīs + 1 Skimmer if you say itīs better - thatīs why im here to learn and listen to more experienced people
      Regarding the filter - M sized Proficlear filter would be too small. I was looking for the L size of it with flow rate of 25k liters/hour.
      Wouldnt it affect the quality of the Moving bed module filtration with that high turn over rate?
      Will 1 moving bed with 50k Hel-X media be enough?? Shouldnīt i put 2 later to ensure correct bio quality? Not sure how much more Hel-X can i add to the MB.

      Main filtration i want to use:
      RDF: https://www.oase.sk/produkt/oase-pro...er-gravity-fed
      MB: https://www.oase.sk/produkt/oase-pro...ving-bed-modul

      Best regards,
      Miro
      That one looks better... but I don't have any first hand knowledge of how well they work.

      I've read different opinions about bio media and flow rates. The one I've mostly heard
      was the bio conversion process happens almost instantly so flow rate isn't that important.
      Others say there's a certain "dwell time" that it needs. I use a shower and it pretty much
      pours water over the media at a rate of about 8,000-9,000 gph so not much actual contact
      time and it works very well.
      Whether that amount of bio media is enough depends on the number and size of fish, and feed
      rate, etc...

      Quote Originally Posted by Nguyen365 View Post
      https://playitkoi.com/products/profi...5141666Īcy=USD. Gets my vote. Has rdf and moving bed all in one for $5700. Plus later you can add shower ontop of unit if you wanted more bio.
      I don't think they ship to Slovakia.
      --Steve


      “First in excellence
      frist in pride"
      --Weeds

    13. #13
      GomeZko is offline Junior Member
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      Guys i canīt open those links - looks like the site is only opened for US customers only.
      Iīve heared only good things about showers, but i should add it later when my future fish get bigger

    14. #14
      icu2's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by GomeZko View Post
      Guys i canīt open those links - looks like the site is only opened for US customers only.
      Iīve heared only good things about showers, but i should add it later when my future fish get bigger
      Sorry, I didn't realize they wouldn't open outside the U.S.
      Here are some screen shots that at least show the products:

      Name:  Image5.jpg
Views: 74
Size:  57.5 KB

      Name:  Image4.jpg
Views: 72
Size:  41.5 KB

      Name:  Image6.jpg
Views: 74
Size:  39.9 KB
      --Steve


      “First in excellence
      frist in pride"
      --Weeds

    15. #15
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      Or this monster flows 16,600 Gallon per hour.
      Attached Images Attached Images  
      Last edited by Nguyen365; 4 Days Ago at 01:17 PM.

    16. #16
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      Nice machines.. However these are not selled in my area.. closes to those that are available are Filtreco systems : Combi Drum Filter 35 Gravity Filtreco
      https://www.koikapor.sk/p/2305/combi...avity-filtreco
      Name:  combi-drum-filter-55-gravity-filtreco1.jpg
Views: 66
Size:  80.4 KB
      This on is available in versions of 25/35 and 55 liters/hour.

      or cheaper variant from different company - Combi NEXT 30 - Filtreau
      Name:  combinext.600x0.jpg
Views: 68
Size:  19.2 KB
      https://www.koikapor.sk/p/2844/combi-next-30

      Is this better alternative to Oase?

    17. #17
      icu2's Avatar
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      I understand they aren't sold there but was just trying to show other options.

      I don't know anyone that has used those that you linked to, but the extra 110mm inputs
      would make connecting your bottom drains (BD) and skimmer(s) much easier. I can't read the
      text on the site but if I picked the flow rates out correctly it looks like 35 m3/h (9240 gph) and
      30 m3/h (7900 gph)? It looks like the larger Oase one flows 25 m3/h (6600 gph)? If those
      are right, and if you can afford it and the Next 35 gets good product reviews from users,
      that's the one I'd go with. You could flow 3500 gph from each BD and 2000 gph from a skimmemr
      and be just slightly under the max of the filter.
      --Steve


      “First in excellence
      frist in pride"
      --Weeds

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