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  • Results 1 to 16 of 16

    Thread: Omosaka Shiro Utsuri Grow Out

    1. #1
      UtsuriKoi is offline Junior Member
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      Omosako Shiro Utsuri Grow Out

      Greetings,

      I bought my first two koi through a Omosako Shiro Utsuri grow out. I know very little about koi, so I am curious about their growth potential. Any thoughts/advice would be much appreciated!
      Attached Images Attached Images   
      Last edited by UtsuriKoi; 2 Weeks Ago at 09:54 PM.

    2. #2
      abuchi123's Avatar
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      You did good. Both are nice SU with good skin and quality sumi. I will stick my neck out and say they look female.

    3. #3
      UtsuriKoi is offline Junior Member
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      Thanks for the feedback!

      I selected them after reading about judging koi and selecting young koi for future potential, even though many of the concepts remain vague to me.

      For example, I read that skin quality is one of the most important criteria and that silk white is preferred to cotton white. Based on my understanding, the first koi is closer to cotton white, and the second is closer to silk white. Is this correct?

      I am also curious why you think they look female. I read that pectoral fins of females are bigger, rounder, and more transparent. They both seem to have fins that fit this description, but the second one more than the first. Is your assessment based on pectoral fins or something else?

      Any guidance is appreciated!

    4. #4
      Russell Peters's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by UtsuriKoi View Post
      Thanks for the feedback!

      I selected them after reading about judging koi and selecting young koi for future potential, even though many of the concepts remain vague to me.

      For example, I read that skin quality is one of the most important criteria and that silk white is preferred to cotton white. Based on my understanding, the first koi is closer to cotton white, and the second is closer to silk white. Is this correct?

      I am also curious why you think they look female. I read that pectoral fins of females are bigger, rounder, and more transparent. They both seem to have fins that fit this description, but the second one more than the first. Is your assessment based on pectoral fins or something else?

      Any guidance is appreciated!
      The only information in this sentence that is correct is the transparency of the fins. The other information is wrong. These fins look male to me, not female, because male fins are large and round. Female fins tend to have a point on them. Time will tell though as you will be able to milt them at some point.
      people like to vehemently defend their purchases and find it incredulous that anything could be better

    5. #5
      UtsuriKoi is offline Junior Member
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      Name:  Screenshot_20190808-222617_Chrome.jpg
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    6. #6
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      Quote Originally Posted by UtsuriKoi View Post
      Name:  Screenshot_20190808-222617_Chrome.jpg
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      Yup, that info is wrong...finding info on the internet does not mean it is correct. I got my info from Toshio Sakai, AKA Matsunosuke, and it is the opposite of what you got off of a website. I have found his information to be true in every case. He drew it out for me and shows the exact opposite of what ever website you got your info from.

      I have removed the drawing of the pecs as it was never intended to be posted.
      Last edited by Russell Peters; 2 Weeks Ago at 04:27 PM.
      people like to vehemently defend their purchases and find it incredulous that anything could be better

    7. #7
      Russell Peters's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by UtsuriKoi View Post
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      The comments about the male pecs having a solid color to them like the pictures seems rather odd too. What if there is NO color in the fins at all. What does it look like then? If the fins are white then they can't have the color of the pics.
      people like to vehemently defend their purchases and find it incredulous that anything could be better

    8. #8
      UtsuriKoi is offline Junior Member
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      Interesting - thanks for your insights. As a novice, I've been trying to acquire acknowledge by reading forums, blogs, etc., but I've encountered so much misinformation or incomplete information that the exercise seems futile at this point.

      I found this description of the fins from www.koi-fish.com/koi-care/sexing-koi.html

    9. #9
      Marilyn's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Russell Peters View Post
      The comments about the male pecs having a solid color to them like the pictures seems rather odd too. What if there is NO color in the fins at all. What does it look like then? If the fins are white then they can't have the color of the pics.
      I believe this is a less than clear way of saying that male pecs are denser and more opaque while female pecs usually are more transparent and delicate.
      Color does not figure into it at all so it's confusing and inaccurate.
      Still learning as I go but y'all can call me Marilyn

    10. #10
      UtsuriKoi is offline Junior Member
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      My interpretation was that white fins could range from completely clear to solid white with no light penetration, with translucent in between. I assumed females fell to the left of the spectrum, while males fell to the right.

      I also read on the internet (ha!) that, among males, the leading ray of the pectoral fin is darker than the rest of the fin, whereas the pectoral fin is more uniform throughout among females . Do you have insights on this?

    11. #11
      Marilyn's Avatar
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      In general, yes, the leading ray on males will be very strong. It's not an absolute. I've had females that I would have sworn were male based on pecs and visa versa.
      Males tend to have denser cartilage structure in their pecs but again, it's not an absolute.
      Still learning as I go but y'all can call me Marilyn

    12. #12
      UtsuriKoi is offline Junior Member
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      Thanks for the reply.

      So the general consensus is that they are nice SU based on skin and sumi, but the sex is ambiguous at this point based on the photo. These are my first koi, so I'm stoked regardless.

    13. #13
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      Quote Originally Posted by UtsuriKoi View Post
      Thanks for the reply.

      So the general consensus is that they are nice SU based on skin and sumi, but the sex is ambiguous at this point based on the photo. These are my first koi, so I'm stoked regardless.
      Yes, I think you did well.
      people like to vehemently defend their purchases and find it incredulous that anything could be better

    14. #14
      abuchi123's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Marilyn View Post
      In general, yes, the leading ray on males will be very strong. It's not an absolute. I've had females that I would have sworn were male based on pecs and visa versa.
      Males tend to have denser cartilage structure in their pecs but again, it's not an absolute.
      I am with you on p-fins. There are so many theories. Big/Small fins, Thick/small bones, Transparency, Round/Pointy ... . When I sample my herd ranging from tosai to nanasai, I see confirmed females with male looking fins and males with fins that pass female tests. On gosanke, the softness of the skin/beni is a better indicator but by the time that is apparent, the body shape already confirmed that.

      All I know is, every tosai I bought this year are females ... until they break my heart.

    15. #15
      CALHOUN is offline Senior Member
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      Nice fish, donít wonít to hijack your thread but with all the talk of male or female wanted to share these pics of the vents of a few fish I recently moved along. Males or females?

      Iím no expert but felt the last one is male for sure, top I think may be male and the middle is female? Iíll add the pics of the fish after we get some feedback.


      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
      Last edited by CALHOUN; 1 Week Ago at 06:25 AM.

    16. #16
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      M-f-m

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