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  • Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
    Results 21 to 28 of 28

    Thread: Maybe Bacterial?

    1. #21
      inazuma28 is offline Senior Member
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      Quote Originally Posted by KoiRun View Post
      Re:
      http://www.fishmoxfishflex.com/index...otics.html?p=2

      Unbelievable!

      This a great way to spread antibiotic resistant bugs. It's a real problem.
      Go to a qualified vet. Learn to keep your water; learn from your mistakes (from other's mistakes) etc. and go on.



      We are running out of drugs to use to treat infections (often life-threatening ones).
      R- resistant to antibiotic
      S- sensitive to antibiotic
      Attachment 589816
      I get where youre coming from. Im a medical professional. Antibiotic resistant microbes exist and they are a real problem. The real issue is hitting an organism with a drug and not finishing the course. As far as who is responsible, it's not the use of the drug, it's people not following the instruction. And in order for the population of microbes to be resistant, they would have to already have the genetic resistance BEFORE the drug is administered.

      As for why would someone use drugs without a vet? Well, simple. There is ONE aquatic vet in my area and he charges a rediculous amount of money just to show up. My vet that used to perscribe for me retired. So with the options of spending far more than the value of the fish, letting the fish die, or sourcing some cheap antibiotics, the choice is simple.

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    2. #22
      inazuma28 is offline Senior Member
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      Quote Originally Posted by icu2 View Post
      Thanks for that link. Do you just crush up the Cipro tablets or how do you treat using it?
      Looks like the tetracycline is discontinued.
      I dont recomend people doing what I did, but I looked up the dose per weight, estimated the weight using the length as a proxy with some equation, crushed and weighed the powder, disolved it in water, put the fish under anesthesia, and used a long soft plastic pipett to administer the drug orally. Its quite easy to get the meds down the pharynx. I do not recomend doing this because the only data I have is anecdotal because Ive only done it to two fish. It worked in both. I saved one Shiro, and one Sanke using this method. The shiro was so bad I doubteded anything would work and I couldnt get injectables. It worked so well in conjunction with raised temp that when My sanke got a nasty unlcer, I repeagted the process.

    3. #23
      AkwaKoi's Avatar
      AkwaKoi is offline Senior Member
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      Quote Originally Posted by KoiRun View Post
      Re:
      http://www.fishmoxfishflex.com/index...otics.html?p=2

      Unbelievable!

      This a great way to spread antibiotic resistant bugs. It's a real problem.
      Go to a qualified vet. Learn to keep your water; learn from your mistakes (from other's mistakes) etc. and go on.



      We are running out of drugs to use to treat infections (often life-threatening ones).
      R- resistant to antibiotic
      S- sensitive to antibiotic
      Attachment 589816
      Thank you for alerting all of us about those "superbugs". The US CDC (Center for Disease Control and Prevention) also has a lengthy report saying the saying the same thing . https://www.cdc.gov/drugresistance/s...orted-mcr.html

    4. #24
      kdh is offline Senior Member
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      So one vet only uses one injection of baytril. Another 5. And another 3. For same issue as they did not test for what bacterial issue it is. hmm
      I have used just one shot and worked great. But have had to use more based on how the koi was healing. Koi are all healed. How did I create super bugs. To blame the public is a little far reaching as a lot of the superbugs today were created by antibiotics (only) available through doctors. If a vet comes out and gives one injection and I give one injection. What is the def.

    5. #25
      inazuma28 is offline Senior Member
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      Quote Originally Posted by kdh View Post
      So one vet only uses one injection of baytril. Another 5. And another 3. For same issue as they did not test for what bacterial issue it is. hmm
      I have used just one shot and worked great. But have had to use more based on how the koi was healing. Koi are all healed. How did I create super bugs. To blame the public is a little far reaching as a lot of the superbugs today were created by antibiotics (only) available through doctors. If a vet comes out and gives one injection and I give one injection. What is the def.
      What I was reffering to was not Vets or treating fish. I was reffering to the common recipeint of antibiotics at the doctor. Its EXTREMELY common for layfolks to get a 10 day perscription for antibiotics. They feel fine after 3 days and they stop taking the drugs. The bacteria that are left (the ones able to resist the drug for 3 days) reproduce to form a stronger bacterial colony. Some bacteria actually have plasmids that encode for enzymes that destroy antibiotics. These plasmids can be passed from bacteri to bacteria. Using antibiotics does not create antibiotic resistant bacteria but it does weed out the week ones and leave the strong ones to make strong progeny. Now, if you take the bacteria that lived for 3 days and treat them for 10 days, they may still die. When the lab tells you the bacteria is resistant, it means that they are resistant to the minimum effective dose.

      - And you are 100% correct in your implication of doctors and vets for contributing as well. It is extremely irresponsible to give one injection when 3 are required.
      Last edited by inazuma28; 02-21-2019 at 07:16 PM.

    6. #26
      smoothee50 is offline Junior Member
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      UPDATE

      Fish has still not improved. I just recently moved him into a hospital tank because he is starting to slow down and other fish
      We’re bumping into him. Finally got some Ciprofloxacin and started a course 2 days ago. Water quality has been staying
      Constant and no other fish are showing any signs of sickness. He is still eating and swimming fine but has lost a lot of
      Scales. Here are some pics. Name:  6EC1C4EF-0DCD-4D49-955D-4AB141964209.jpg
Views: 103
Size:  79.8 KBName:  6EC1C4EF-0DCD-4D49-955D-4AB141964209.jpg
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Size:  79.8 KBName:  82E52B13-80BB-4ACE-A83A-EF3A576BF17D.jpg
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Size:  49.2 KB

    7. #27
      fly4koi is offline Senior Member
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      Can be fungal or parasite. If you have microscope I've found that to be helpful. Have you gotten some Tricide Neo to try?
      Nevermind, I read the earlier posts you've tried. In that case it can be costia or sap. Both can be treated with ProformC, I think.
      Last edited by fly4koi; 04-18-2019 at 01:52 AM.

    8. #28
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      richtoybox is offline Administrator
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      I don't know if this fish can be cured, but having it in a hospital tank is a start. One, keep a close eye on the ammonia level, as a smaller tank changes faster, and if ammonia is detected, bind it with Safe, Prime, or Cloram-X, and use a SeaChem Ammonia Alert Card to assure the ammonia is not toxic ammonia. If toxic, retreat with the binder. Two, get the temperature up to close to 75F(25C) to speed the healing process and raise the salinity to 0.8%, about 7 pounds per 100 gallons to take pressure off the kidneys due to the damage to the skin allowing increased amounts of water through the membrane called skin. The antibiotic should help, but the key now in addition to the antibiotic is time, temperature and extremely good water quality.
      Zone 7 A/B
      Keep your words sweet. You never know when you may have to eat them.
      Richard

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