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  • Results 1 to 9 of 9

    Thread: Yentyl is loner, small brain? sick?... one is not like the others. Worried fish mama

    1. #1
      Koigarden's Avatar
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      Yentyl is loner, small brain? sick?... one is not like the others. Worried fish mama

      This is my first try at growing out a box of baby koi for the winter. They are indoors, on soft water and I've had them 8 weeks. They were shipped as 2 to 2.5 inch butterfly.
      I had problems at first with what was probably fin rot and lost some initially but was told to warm them up ( now 68F) and add more salt (now .35%) and so I have been over that issue for a while.

      Tank is poly stocktank
      ammonia & nitrite are 0,
      pH 7.4, and
      nitrate 20
      daily: vacuuming bottom and 5-10% water change

      There were some that just seemed to be really weak swimmers and oblivious, they didn't move like the others and didn't seem to hide as fast.
      They had wispy too thin tail stems. Most of them didn't make it.
      Well here is the last one to exhibit these behaviors, his name is Yentyl, and I wondered if there is something here that I should cull so it doesn't sicken the others or is this just a weirdo or poor genetics or?

      What he does different:
      very very slender
      doesn't school
      often sits
      prefers head to the wall or head in the sponges or hiding during meals
      he always swims slow
      often bumps his head( lips) on the side of the tank
      hangs out head up like a gecko on the wall
      rarely eats
      rarely swims the length of the tank
      hides more than the others
      hasn't grown much if at all

      It looks like all his fins move and I can see his eyes move and he does occasionally eat very little. It seems like he can move in all directions and never rolls over. I'm attACHING SOME VIDEO but it looks like it has to go to FB first to get a video added here. I'll sent this first.
      LMK your thoughts on Yentyl. Thanks!

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      koi4u2c is offline Senior Member
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      His behavior could be from insecurity and no place to hide. Small fish sometimes react like this when in a tank. Bumping mouth on side of tank could be looking for food.

      He is slender, but if he lives he may turn out to be a very nice butterfly koi. Nice tail and fins. The slender goes with this type of long fin koi and since it is so small it is not filled out yet.
      Nancy



    5. #5
      RichToyBox's Avatar
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      I am not seeing any strange behavior indicating parasites or bacterial infection. I would just wait and see if it grows. Some grow much slower than others and some will top out at close to half the length of their bigger siblings.

      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."

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      Richard

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      Oh that's good. Ok Rich I'm glad you are here because guess what came in the mail today... my GH and KH test kit. so Here are the findings.... and I know you said that my outside pond would stay at 8.2 pH and then swing in the spring with the switching to soft water so. I hope you can help me understand these results are off the chart.

      Outside pond at 25% water change . ammonia stayed 50, sorry to say, pH stayed 8.2 Temp is 39F, but I did another water change today and will wait a couple days for that to mix up ( no filter in winter) and test again....
      so outside pond:
      GH 16 drops ( off the chart) and KH 20 drops ( off the chart). this is mostly well water, I'm water changing it to soft water slowly as my well water is testing positive for ammonia. So my salt in there is .35% and I know that shows up on the gh test right?

      Next my soft water in my stock tank with Yentyl - this water goes thru the Culligan water softener and it tests:
      GH is 3 drops so the chart says that = ppm gh/kh 53.7. and dKH 3 so my general hardness and .35% salt is 53.7 and what is dKH 3?
      then my kh on my stock tank is 19 ( off the chart).
      are these numbers any better for koi?

    7. #7
      RichToyBox's Avatar
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      A water softener will reduce the GH but should not affect the KH. I don't think the softener will affect the ammonia, but there may be some form of treatment in line that I am unfamniliar with that will remove the ammonia. check it out of the tap, allowing the water to run for a few minutes first, and see if it is very low or still the same as the outside hose. Salt will not affect the GH or the KH, but will show up in TDS (Total Dissolved Solids). Until the KH falls to below about 80, there will be essentially no change in the pH. GH is a measure of the calcium, magnesium, some iron, aluminum, copper, and other ions of plus 2 valence, so will not measure sodium which is plus 1. The KH measures for most of us the carbonate/bicarbonate concentration by determining the number of drops of acid it takes to change the pH. To reduce the pH, which I generally discourage, but for your ammonia levels I encourage, get a product from the aquarium store called pH down for small containers, or muratic acid for larger bodies of water. Add slowly. You will see a pH shift on adding, but it will bounce back up with mixing due to the consumption of the KH. Once the KH is down to about 80 the pH will start to shift, and then you need to move much slower to be sure that you don't crash the pH.

      The inside facility may have a filter that is removing he ammonia, but the outside pond with no filtration is not converting the ammonia. This could be the explanation for the low ammonia inside.
      Last edited by RichToyBox; 12-22-2018 at 10:52 PM.

      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."

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      Richard

    8. #8
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      Well I am worried about the ammonia and the pH. And yes it is coming out of the well as I have tested it right out of the hose, but not inside the house, inside it tests 0 in the sink, so I know it's coming from the well. Now I have the pond spigot switched to soft water to fix this for the 2nd water change today.

      I want to make sure I get what you are saying. "Until the KH falls to below about 80, there will be essentially no change in the pH."
      OK am I understanding how to tell when this is about to happen? 80 on my api chart corresponds with 4.5 drops of KH , GH test reagent. so when it has enough water changes that I do a GH test and at 6 drops the color changes THEN its about to have a big swing, then I should proceed with smaller water changes then 25% because the fish are going to get a shock going quickly from 8.2 to 7.4?

    9. #9
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      Yes, Until you get the KH to the 5 or 6 drops, you don't have to worry about getting a true pH change. This is with the KH test drops, the GH could go down to zero drops and the pH would stay the same. I would be interested in knowing what the ammonia test is showing from the softened water at the end of a pond fill. The only treatments that I know for ammonia are carbon filters and depending on the size, they can be overrun and the ammonia will continue to show at some point in time. If the flow rate is too high, ammonia will go through the filter, though some could be being consumed.

      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."

      Zone 7 A/B
      Keep your words sweet. You never know when you may have to eat them.
      Richard

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