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  • Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
    Results 21 to 38 of 38

    Thread: James' pond rebuild in NC

    1. #21
      nil13 is offline Senior Member
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      How deep is the pond currently.

    2. #22
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      Quote Originally Posted by nil13 View Post
      How deep is the pond currently.
      It’s currently 24”

    3. #23
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      So it's been a couple of weeks and after much discussion I've revised my plan. My current thought is to take advice provide and go with a Zakki Sieve and ultimately a Bead Filter but will probably start off with a couple of 55G filters. I already have a Rhino II 4inch BD and two TPR jets. So couple of questions still.

      1. Skimmers - Any recommendations? I really like the design of the Helix but I'm not sure if it's worth the money or not. Before I pull the trigger on that, what are your opinions and/or recommendations?

      2. Location of the Sieve and Filters. The attraction of the Zakki is it can remain above ground since the pump goes after it in the circuits. So I can put life support nearer the pond, let the pump pull uphill to Sieve and then gravity feed the other filters and I think there is enough fall to gravity feed the jets and water fall. This is the main plan. I played with some math earlier in the thread about relocating life support up to 75 feet away and it seemed viable. What I'm wondering is?
      * Would you gravity feed to the Sieve and filtration, then put the pump on the end to pump back to the pond (since it would be uphill at this point)? This seems like the logical approach. Again, assuming the numbers work out, right now it's more I'm not sure the best/correct way to design the circuit.

      3. What size pump for either scenario. I'm thinking 5500 for the first but what about this alternate plan? What the best way to go about determining the optimum pump size?

      4. Recommendations on pumps?

    4. #24
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      General questions starting out

      So you guys convinced me of a few things so right now I'm trying to figure out sizing and placement of various components before posting a diagram so I've got a few more question. The pond is kidney shaped and the wife wants it to stay that way. It will be enlarged to approx. 16 x 11 x 3.5 give or take, around about 4000 gallons. Since my filtration will be uphill from the pond the Zakki Sieve looks like my best option so I'll feed bottom drain and skimmer to it via pump then on to other filtration gravity feed back to TPR's and waterfall. My primary concerns at the moment are:

      -2x3 inch bottom drains or 1x4 inch one. I can taper the sides towards the middle for a 1x4 BD but it seems like things might go better with two 3" inch ones. (I currently have a Rhino 4" aerated BD but I can return it if need be).
      - If 2x3 do I tie them together right before entering the Sieve?
      - Begs the question which Zakki sieve would be best? 16 inch or 24 inch?
      - If 2x3 should they both be aerated or just one?

      - TPRs? I originally was thinking 2 going in kind of a big circular motion but have since seen diagrams where people used 3 and had them cross. 1 in each of the small humps of the kidney shape and 1 in middle of the long arch side.
      - I assume skimmer size doesn't mean much, but where should it be placed? If the waterfall is between the two small humps?
      - What size pipe from skimmer to Sieve?
      - What size pipe back to the TPRs
      - What size pipe back to waterfall?

      The other things I'm not even sure about at this point are:
      - pump size, since I assume that depends on the above, so I'm flexible there.
      - filtration after the sieve. I'm currently thinking a bead filter but I've also looked at the Zakki shower. Question is, do you need anything else besides one of those two?

      Thanks guys.
      Last edited by RustedBucket; 09-21-2018 at 09:00 AM. Reason: Changing title of post

    5. #25
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      Plumbing questions

      Based on the most excellent write up by Boggen in the thread understanding currents within a pond to obtain an ideal self cleaning pond I believe the best answer for my setup is going to be based on this diagram.
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      Two 3" BDs that feed into a Zakki Sieve, again, I assume the tie together right before entering the Sieve.
      Should the return feed the TPRs via 1.5" or 2" pipe??

      Then skimmer feeding the Zakki via 2" pipe.

      Does this sound like a reasonable start? Since the Zakki 16" handles up to 4500gph would it need to be larger in order to handle the 2 BDs and Skimmer?

    6. #26
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      I'd go with the 2 x 3" BD's. Rule of thumb is a 4" BD will be effective in about a 12' diameter while a
      3" will work out to about 10'... so with a pond floor of 16' the 2 x 3" choice will be much better imo.

      I've never had a Zakki sieve so I can't help with how they should be joined together but flow wise I think I'd spring
      for the 24" in sieve. Each 3" BD should be flow about 2000-2500 gph min to keep them clear of debris and figuring another
      2000-2500 from the skimmer and you're well beyond the 4500 gph limit of the 16" sieve.

      If the TPR's and waterfall will be gravity returning to the pond, size will depend on how far and complex the route
      is back to the pond and the flow rate of each. I'd say nothing smaller than 2" for 2000 gph and I'd go larger for more flow
      or complicated routes with multiple bends.

      Showers are my favorite bio filter, but if you do that I'd combine it with s/g filters for fines filtration that you'd
      normally have with a bead filter.


      Good luck with the build!
      --Steve
      Find more about Weather in Poulsbo, WA

      "I know what I have to do now. I got to keep breathing. Because tomorrow the sun will rise.
      Who knows what the tide could bring." --Tom Hanks in Cast Away

    7. #27
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      Just out of curiosity, since I have a 4" Rhino II sitting in the garage, I caught it on sale, any reason not to just use it and get a 3" Koi Toilet or just get another Rhino?

    8. #28
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      Pond is empty, ready to pull the liner
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      Liners out, ready to start some digging
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    9. #29
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      So I took a stab at Photoshopping things. I'm thinking I'll just have Zac build me a P&P filtration system so I don't have to worry with it. Still unsure of what pipe size to use for the TPRs and waterfall.

      For the returns, should they be TPRs or GPRs or better question is probably should they expel at angles or straight out?

    10. #30
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      Quote Originally Posted by RustedBucket View Post
      So I took a stab at Photoshopping things. I'm thinking I'll just have Zac build me a P&P filtration system so I don't have to worry with it. Still unsure of what pipe size to use for the TPRs and waterfall.

      For the returns, should they be TPRs or GPRs or better question is probably should they expel at angles or straight out?
      I used 1 1/2" tpr's for my upper pond and regret it to this day. I'd use minimum of 2". Less head for the pump
      designed like you have now and then if you want to change to something that would feed them via gravity, you still
      can. 1 1/2" you're pretty locked into pump feeding them forever.

      I think the TPR/GPR term gets tossed around together, but iirc "GPR" is to designate when an underwater
      return is positioned between two BD's as opposed to a pointed direction. But I'd keep that one straight;
      the others would work either way, pretty much your preference imo.
      --Steve
      Find more about Weather in Poulsbo, WA

      "I know what I have to do now. I got to keep breathing. Because tomorrow the sun will rise.
      Who knows what the tide could bring." --Tom Hanks in Cast Away

    11. #31
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      Spent the weekend in playing in the dirt but got a nice pit ready to start working on foundation for the block wall.

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      You gotta love NC clay

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      Getting closer
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      One could argue I almost know what I'm doing
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      The small pile on the far left is 2 Saturday afternoons digging out behind the pond with a shovel as opposed to two days with a backhoe and loaded.

    12. #32
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      I have a zakki sieve and custom shower for sale if you are interested. I live in Charlotte, NC. PM me if interested.

    13. #33
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      Looks like lots of fun! I have 2 suggestions for you. First on the pressure side (after the pumps) go at least 2" pipe. If I was going to redo my pond I would use 3". The reason is that the difference in head will allow you to either get more flow form your pump or use a smaller pump to get the same flow for less electricity. You buy the pump and pipe once but the utility bill shows up every month...
      Second, On your bottom drains. Make sure you run them uphill not downhill! The pipe should run about 1/8 to 1/4 inch uphill for each foot of horizontal run. This is exactly opposite what a sanitary line in your house does and the reason is you want to do this is the air that will precipitate out of the flow can travel with the flow to the filter uphill as it wants to do. If you slope downhill, the air has to fight against the direction of flow to escape uphill. This can cause the air bubble to grow and cause a reduction in flow rate. If you size your pipe correctly for the flow rate the solids will have no trouble being carried up the very slight slope.
      Also a cleanout on these line is a good thing. Just ask anyone who has had an unexpected item end up in the line.
      I am in the piedmont south of Greensboro so I can understand your challenges with clay and sandrock!
      Looking good, please keep us updated!
      Regards, Ken

      The most powerful point of suction in the pond occurs at our checking account. It's all Marges fault!

    14. #34
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      Coming along

      Well, after quite literally 6 months of rain every few days, two hurricanes, two surgeries and just life in general, I made it back to the pond. Being 5000 degrees for most of September in NC has not made this a fast process but it's taking shape. Here's some of the progress.

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      Dry fitting to get the pattern the boss wants.

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      Harbor Freight special. Great $200 investment.

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      And starting the climb out of the ground.

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      Almost there.. Stay on target.

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      Topped out. Yay!!!

      I learned I can't quit my day job to lay block... I'd go hungry for sure. Any how, rebar every 4th cell and second and fourth rows. Every other cell is filled solid. I did get the returns cut in last weekend. ***Note*** set these before going to the next level of block. Next up is a bond coat to add some strength and help smooth out the block for the liner. Hoping to have bottom drains in and ready for liner by Thanksgiving.

    15. #35
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      Lookin' good!
      I bought one of those HF mixers... one of the best things I bought building the ponds.
      --Steve
      Find more about Weather in Poulsbo, WA

      "I know what I have to do now. I got to keep breathing. Because tomorrow the sun will rise.
      Who knows what the tide could bring." --Tom Hanks in Cast Away

    16. #36
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      Quote Originally Posted by RustedBucket View Post
      Well, after quite literally 6 months of rain every few days, two hurricanes, two surgeries and just life in general, I made it back to the pond. Being 5000 degrees for most of September in NC has not made this a fast process but it's taking shape. Here's some of the progress.


      Dry fitting to get the pattern the boss wants.


      Harbor Freight special. Great $200 investment.


      And starting the climb out of the ground.


      Almost there.. Stay on target.


      Topped out. Yay!!!

      I learned I can't quit my day job to lay block... I'd go hungry for sure. Any how, rebar every 4th cell and second and fourth rows. Every other cell is filled solid. I did get the returns cut in last weekend. ***Note*** set these before going to the next level of block. Next up is a bond coat to add some strength and help smooth out the block for the liner. Hoping to have bottom drains in and ready for liner by Thanksgiving.
      The weather sure has been wild here in NC this year. Seemed like it was in the mid to high 90's for three months.

      Best of luck with your pond build.
      Nancy



      Koiphen 2013 Koi Person of the Year!

    17. #37
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      Bond coat added, mostly to smooth the sides for the liner and the added strength will be nice. Filled the last cells today ready to start digging the bottom drains just in time for the ground to freeze....

    18. #38
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      Quote Originally Posted by RustedBucket View Post
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      Bond coat added, mostly to smooth the sides for the liner and the added strength will be nice. Filled the last cells today ready to start digging the bottom drains just in time for the ground to freeze....
      Wow so nice

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