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    Thread: Shower filter media question

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    1. #1
      kimini is offline Senior Member
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      Shower filter media question

      I recently handled some surprisingly stiff open-cell foam, you know, the traditional foam that's "squishy." So, why isn't this being used as media instead of the very expensive ceramic stuff? Back in the day, foam filters failed due to how easily they'd clog, but now, with RDFs and sieves, don't they deserve reconsideration as a shower media? The sample in question, 3 x 3 x 0.75, took about 5 lbs to compress. I don't know the material but it shouldn't be too hard to figure out.

      It's too late for me, having just bought some ceramic filter media, but I can't think of a good reason why it wouldn't be a MUCH cheaper and lighter approach for shower filter media.

      And lastly, if the media - ceramic or foam rubber - does clog, only one of them can be "wrung out." So what's wrong with this idea?
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      Last edited by kimini; 08-10-2018 at 11:42 AM.

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      ricshaw is offline Senior Member
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      Give it a try and report back to us.

    3. #3
      kimini is offline Senior Member
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      Like I said, I already have the ceramic media, though I may put a foam layer on the top just for fun. It would also serve to show what's getting through the RDF.

      One downside of the foam is that it "may" have far less surface area, though without testing, it's just a hunch.
      Last edited by kimini; 08-10-2018 at 03:37 PM.

    4. #4
      Zac Penn is offline Supporting Member
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      Quote Originally Posted by kimini View Post
      I recently handled some surprisingly stiff open-cell foam, you know, the traditional foam that's "squishy." So, why isn't this being used as media instead of the very expensive ceramic stuff? Back in the day, foam filters failed due to how easily they'd clog, but now, with RDFs and sieves, don't they deserve reconsideration as a shower media? The sample in question, 3 x 3 x 0.75, took about 5 lbs to compress. I don't know the material but it shouldn't be too hard to figure out.

      It's too late for me, having just bought some ceramic filter media, but I can't think of a good reason why it wouldn't be a MUCH cheaper and lighter approach for shower filter media.

      And lastly, if the media - ceramic or foam rubber - does clog, only one of them can be "wrung out." So what's wrong with this idea?
      Quote Originally Posted by kimini View Post
      Like I said, I already have the ceramic media, though I may put a foam layer on the top just for fun. It would also serve to show what's getting through the RDF.

      One downside of the foam is that it "may" have far less surface area, though without testing, it's just a hunch.
      Well I am late to the party here, but you answered your own question. The plastic foam filters like you are holding are small extruded threads that are wiggled around to build up a certain thickness. There is only the surface area of the thin thread for bacteria to colonize on. The Rio Media has solid sidewalls on the passages so there exponentially more surface area for colonization on ceramic media surfaces Cermedia and Rio.

      As you said, overtime I expect some of the really thin passageways will end up getting clogged to some extent if the water isn't pre-filtered well enough. I don't like to touch on the denitrification topic, because I don't think it is something that can be counted on in a koi pond, but I think the only way this would happen with Rio Media would be if you directly stack many pieces without a divider plate between them. You would probably need a media block 12"+ thick in order to remove enough oxygen for the "Mythical" denitrification process to possibly happen
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    5. #5
      kevin32 is offline Inactivated
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      My friend uses pads and feather rock and also has some ceramic media. None of it has clogged or has needed cleaning. The key is to not stack the matting. So if using Japanese matting make sure to space it out. It all works but I honestly can't say which is the best. I'm happy with my feather rock and ceramic media I'm using. Pads do build up bacteria well also.

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      MCAsan is offline Senior Member
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      I ran cartridges of Matala grey matting in my shower for over a year while I looked for a replacement for Cermedia MP2C. You can definitely do matting for nitrification. Just don't expect any denitificaiton as there are no hidden areas in that media unlike the ceramic medias or feather rock or lava rock.
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      Last edited by MCAsan; 08-10-2018 at 07:38 PM.

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      Quote Originally Posted by MCAsan View Post
      I ran cartridges of Matala grey matting in my shower for over a year while I looked for a replacement for Cermedia MP2C. You can definitely do matting for nitrification. Just don't expect any denitificaiton as there are no hidden areas in that media unlike the ceramic medias or feather rock or lava rock.
      I agree..can you go more into denitrification? Can it help degas some things in the shower? I believe it can off gas nitrogen? I've had a few beers and cant remember the word I'm looking for lol

    8. #8
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      Quote Originally Posted by MCAsan View Post
      I ran cartridges of Matala grey matting in my shower for over a year while I looked for a replacement for Cermedia MP2C. You can definitely do matting for nitrification. Just don't expect any denitificaiton as there are no hidden areas in that media unlike the ceramic medias or feather rock or lava rock.
      How do you know or how would you know you are getting denitrification with your ceramic media?
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    9. #9
      ricshaw is offline Senior Member
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      Quote Originally Posted by KoiRun View Post
      How do you know or how would you know you are getting denitrification with your ceramic media?
      I know you do not like answers from Koi keepers... but Tat Li, the person behind RIO Ceramic media, on more than one occasion said he can smell it when standing near a shower filter where denitrification is occurring.

    10. #10
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      Quote Originally Posted by ricshaw View Post
      I know you do not like answers from Koi keepers... but Tat Li, the person behind RIO Ceramic media, on more than one occasion said he can smell it when standing near a shower filter where denitrification is occurring.
      I can smell my shower and said that on here before. Of course I got ripped a new one by the experts. Also I have a very low nitrate level and even did when I was overstocked

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    11. #11
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      Quote Originally Posted by kevin32 View Post
      I can smell my shower and said that on here before. Of course I got ripped a new one by the experts. Also I have a very low nitrate level and even did when I was overstocked
      Ummm try 10-20% water exchange rate weekly including rdf water replacement and flow through not 400%...
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    12. #12
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      Quote Originally Posted by ricshaw View Post
      I know you do not like answers from Koi keepers... but Tat Li, the person behind RIO Ceramic media, on more than one occasion said he can smell it when standing near a shower filter where denitrification is occurring.
      No I’m serious, I want to know the answer whatever it might be.
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      Quote Originally Posted by KoiRun View Post
      No I’m serious, I want to know the answer whatever it might be.
      Typically, the most common evidence of denitrification occurring would be by measuring a decrease in nitrate within the water over time.

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      BWG is offline Senior Member
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      Quote Originally Posted by ricshaw View Post
      I know you do not like answers from Koi keepers... but Tat Li, the person behind RIO Ceramic media, on more than one occasion said he can smell it when standing near a shower filter where denitrification is occurring.
      The air we breathe is 78% nitrogen. Nitrogen gas is colorless and odorless. Maybe he's smelling fishy pond water going through a shower?
      Last edited by BWG; 08-14-2018 at 11:51 PM.

    15. #15
      ricshaw is offline Senior Member
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      Quote Originally Posted by BWG View Post
      The air we breathe is 78% nitrogen. Nitrogen gas is colorless and odorless. Maybe he's smelling fishy pond water going through a shower?
      Yes, Nitrogen gas is odorless, I think he is smelling a byproduct of the denitrification process... Hydrogen sulfide.

      I should make it clear that he sometimes can smell it when he is standing near a shower filter.
      Last edited by ricshaw; 08-15-2018 at 12:25 AM.


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      kimini is offline Senior Member
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      Neither does the ceramic media I have. I suspect over time though that some inner passageways will clog, effectively producing the desired dead ends.

    17. #17
      kevin32 is offline Inactivated
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      Quote Originally Posted by kimini View Post
      Neither does the ceramic media I have. I suspect over time though that some inner passageways will clog, effectively producing the desired dead ends.
      Yes it does. I like the mixture of feather rock and ceramic media. The ceramic does clog from small pores somewhat but the feather rock doesn't and builds up a surface biofilm very well

    18. #18
      kimini is offline Senior Member
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      Don't get me started about feather rock. While it might work great, getting ANY vendor to call me back proved to be impossible. This included 4... FOUR, walk-in visits to a place that carries the boulders, vendors claiming they carry the smaller stuff, and even the mine itself. Nope, they lost me as a customer.

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      Quote Originally Posted by kimini View Post
      Don't get me started about feather rock. While it might work great, getting ANY vendor to call me back proved to be impossible. This included 4... FOUR, walk-in visits to a place that carries the boulders, vendors claiming they carry the smaller stuff, and even the mine itself. Nope, they lost me as a customer.
      For some reason, I did call and confirmed that you can get "ready-to-eat" feather rock at SCal , the 3-4 " chunks for about 40 cpp ... and that was just last year. YMMV.

      I went the caveman way: I bought the feather rock - boulder size ( 6 - 12 " chunks ) and break it down to 3-5" size . That is about 41 cpp and Richert Lumber @ livermore have a couple pallets : the only reason I go locally since i can get it right away , S Cal will be a road trip....



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      MCAsan is offline Senior Member
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      I agree..can you go more into denitrification?
      Denitrification or mineralization is where you have very low dissolved oxygen and plenty of nitrate. A bacteria colony forms that has to strip the oxygen from the nitrate molecules and that releases the remaining nitrogen as small gas bubbles. Some of that can happen inside porous media where the nitrification will happen on the surface. But as the water seeps inside the media where there is less and less oxygen, denitrification can happen.

      http://www.mankysanke.co.uk/html/reducing_nitrate.html

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