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    Thread: Bakki filtration system

    1. #1
      CeD_^ is offline Senior Member
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      Bakki filtration system

      Hi fellow hobbyist.

      Through my research here on the forum, i have found some interesting information about the bakki filtration and its requirements.

      Basically, from my understanding(correct me if i am wrong please), the bakki system needs a very high water flow rate, porous media filter(any porous media filter will do the job) not just BH and containers stacked upon each other to hold the media filter.

      However my questions are:

      1. What about the thickness of the layer of media filter? Should it be thin or thick? the thickness will surely affect the flow of the water passing through the media filter.
      2. Should the containers be closed from the sides or opened? I have read from fellow hobbyists here that they prefer to use containers with open sides as they are more aerated and gases are removed more quickly. Please confirm.

      Help from anybody would be much appreciated =)

      Thanks

      Ced

    2. #2
      Marilyn's Avatar
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      Yep, though a distinction I will make is that a Bakki shower uses Bakki media. Showers using another media are basically just showers.

      As far as depth of media, a lot will depend on media type and container. I like to have some fall/drop between the layers/trays for air flow.
      If your media is more restrictive then a shallower depth should be used.
      As an example, I have lithaqua in some of my showers. The composition is similar to gravel so a very thick single layer would not work. I separate it with sheets of a very open media called matala. I use the most open of the types of matala available. The other media, cermedia, is very open and requires no spacing to maintain good flow.

      Regarding if the sides should be very open a lot depends on how the overall shower unit functions.
      There should be a fair amount of water traveling over the showers. If the sides are open then you are likely to have a lot of splash. A lot of us have a good drop between layers of closed sided trays which allow a lot of air transfer while still minimizing splash.

      Lots of types of media can be used as can lots of different types of trays.
      If the tray is deeper and the media more likely to restrict flow then space out the layers like I did with mine.
      One note, if you do this then cleaning the showers will be more difficult. It's always easier to clean a shallower less densely packed tray than the opposite.

      So keep maintenance in mind. I personally believe to maintain a healthy pond all forms of filtration need to be cleaned periodically. The type of filtration governs the frequency of cleaning as does the bio load.

      Still learning as I go but y'all can call me Marilyn

    3. #3
      birdman's Avatar
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      Lots of people have people have made showers based on 12 by 12 inch high and wide trays, Any length, which seams to work well. The more pours the media the better. My favorite is feather rock with lava rock coming 2nd. I have found these two to work much better than man made media. The rule of thumb is 2000 gph per square foot of surface area.

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      Quote Originally Posted by Marilyn View Post
      Yep, though a distinction I will make is that a Bakki shower uses Bakki media. Showers using another media are basically just showers.

      One note, if you do this then cleaning the showers will be more difficult. It's always easier to clean a shallower less densely packed tray than the opposite.
      Woooops. Didn't realize that there was such a thing as bakki media. My bad for calling my new shower a bakki.

      Having feather rock in my new shower I'm curious how often it would need to be cleaned? How do you know when it needs a cleaning?

      Best thing I ever did to the pond was add a shower!!
      - Sherry & Greg

      21' x 11' x 5.5'
      9000 gal


      Our pond build HERE


      Click for Streamwood, Illinois Forecast

    5. #5
      Marilyn's Avatar
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      It's not a big deal on the name, it just gets a little confusing. I've had people ask what defines a Bakki compared to other showers so I took the opportunity to clarify things a little.

      To answer your cleaning question, so much of that depends on flow and other filtration components. If the water is well filtered of debris before the shower it makes a big difference. It also depends on the bio load. I like to keep mine as clean as possible and have set an annual check for maintenance. I suppose that could change if I get in there and it looks like I should have worked on them sooner.
      Also, some media types are more apt to collect crud. If you're using a media that compacts then it's more likely to need frequent cleanings. As I recall you went with feather rock so it likely won't be that big a deal since it won't be compacting. Just get in there every so often and use the smell and visual test. If you smell or see funk then it went a little too long.

      I love having the showers and have not a single regret in adding mine to the pond. I love the added aeration too.

      Still learning as I go but y'all can call me Marilyn

    6. #6
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      Out of curiosity, how do you clean the filter media? Also, wouldn't that kill the beneficial bacteria?
      Oppurtunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work!"
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    7. #7
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      Quote Originally Posted by birdman View Post
      Lots of people have people have made showers based on 12 by 12 inch high and wide trays, Any length, which seams to work well. The more pours the media the better. My favorite is feather rock with lava rock coming 2nd. I have found these two to work much better than man made media. The rule of thumb is 2000 gph per square foot of surface area.
      What about pumice?
      Oppurtunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work!"
      Thomas Edison

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    8. #8
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      Quote Originally Posted by Loco4Koi View Post
      Out of curiosity, how do you clean the filter media? Also, wouldn't that kill the beneficial bacteria?
      With any media, you clean it with pond water only. You will alway wash away some bacteria during cleaning but they come right back in just couple days and this depends on which type of media. Some plastic media takes weeks for the bacteria to come back.

      Do you backwash your bead filter ?

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      Quote Originally Posted by Loco4Koi View Post
      Out of curiosity, how do you clean the filter media? Also, wouldn't that kill the beneficial bacteria?
      Use the garden hose. You kill some, but so what?

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      Quote Originally Posted by birdman View Post
      Lots of people have people have made showers based on 12 by 12 inch high and wide trays, Any length, which seams to work well. The more pours the media the better. My favorite is feather rock with lava rock coming 2nd. I have found these two to work much better than man made media. The rule of thumb is 2000 gph per square foot of surface area.
      you mentioned a rule of thumb of 2000gph per square foot. Does this take into consideration the number of containers and height of the whole setup? I am thinking about using 4 containers of 2 square foot each. so i would need roughly a pump with capacity of 4000gph?

    11. #11
      CeD_^ is offline Senior Member
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      I am also planning to put a sand filter of 100kg before the shower. what capacity should the pump be with regards to the sand filter AND the shower?

    12. #12
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      Quote Originally Posted by CeD_^ View Post
      you mentioned a rule of thumb of 2000gph per square foot. Does this take into consideration the number of containers and height of the whole setup? I am thinking about using 4 containers of 2 square foot each. so i would need roughly a pump with capacity of 4000gph?
      That's figuring the surface area of the top tray only, so 4 trays, 12 by 48 inches would be 4 sq feet or 8000 gph.

    13. #13
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      Quote Originally Posted by Marilyn View Post
      It's not a big deal on the name, it just gets a little confusing. I've had people ask what defines a Bakki compared to other showers so I took the opportunity to clarify things a little.

      To answer your cleaning question, so much of that depends on flow and other filtration components. If the water is well filtered of debris before the shower it makes a big difference. It also depends on the bio load. I like to keep mine as clean as possible and have set an annual check for maintenance. I suppose that could change if I get in there and it looks like I should have worked on them sooner.
      Also, some media types are more apt to collect crud. If you're using a media that compacts then it's more likely to need frequent cleanings. As I recall you went with feather rock so it likely won't be that big a deal since it won't be compacting. Just get in there every so often and use the smell and visual test. If you smell or see funk then it went a little too long.

      I love having the showers and have not a single regret in adding mine to the pond. I love the added aeration too.

      Thanks!

      Hey Ced, on your questions. My feather rock media is about 8-10" deep per tray which is about 3-4 layers. Doesn't seem to have any flow issues. The sides of my DIY trays are plywood coated with fiberglass. The space between each tray is about 1/2" but the media has about a 2" gap between the bottom of the upper tray and the top of the next tray. Cool to see the water cascading between the trays.
      Guess that really doesn't answer your question of what they should be but mine sure works well.
      - Sherry & Greg

      21' x 11' x 5.5'
      9000 gal


      Our pond build HERE


      Click for Streamwood, Illinois Forecast

    14. #14
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      Quote Originally Posted by gmessler View Post
      Thanks!

      Hey Ced, on your questions. My feather rock media is about 8-10" deep per tray which is about 3-4 layers. Doesn't seem to have any flow issues. The sides of my DIY trays are plywood coated with fiberglass. The space between each tray is about 1/2" but the media has about a 2" gap between the bottom of the upper tray and the top of the next tray. Cool to see the water cascading between the trays.
      Guess that really doesn't answer your question of what they should be but mine sure works well.
      hey gmessler, what is your pump capacity flowing into these trays?

    15. #15
      Loco4Koi's Avatar
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      Can one use pumice instead of feather rock and will that be better than lava rock?
      Oppurtunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work!"
      Thomas Edison

      Love and Tolerance Is Key to Peace and Happiness... as long as you still have a pair

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    16. #16
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      Quote Originally Posted by Loco4Koi View Post
      Can one use pumice instead of feather rock and will that be better than lava rock?
      I'm not sure if better than lava rock, but sure would be lighter (if the Wiki description is correct).

      I'm not convinced on the air exchange thing... but mine is young still. I have a diy type with four 12"x12"x4' containers with
      feather rock and an ESS10500 pump, all stacked with no gaps and it still has worked fine for the last 6 months or so,
      and I don't have any splashing, which is the reason for not leaving spaces. If it wasn't located right against the house,
      I'd put gaps like everyone else.

      --Steve
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    17. #17
      gmessler's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by CeD_^ View Post
      hey gmessler, what is your pump capacity flowing into these trays?
      Right now in order to get the shower up and running I hooked up a small pump running about 3900 gal after head loss. I'll be changing that out as soon as I get new bearings for my ES5500 pumps. Then I'll run 2 ES5500's to the shower. My current return from the shower is a single 4" line but I'll be changing some of the plumbing so it will also feed my 3-2" TPR's. I still may need to throttle them back a little but at least I'll have the flow if I need it.

      Here is my DIY shower thread.

      https://www.koiphen.com/forums/showth...ration-upgrade
      - Sherry & Greg

      21' x 11' x 5.5'
      9000 gal


      Our pond build HERE


      Click for Streamwood, Illinois Forecast

    18. #18
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      Quote Originally Posted by okra View Post
      Use the garden hose. You kill some, but so what?
      I don't think it would be a good idea on a pond that is establishing.
      Rinse the media with pond water, it would be fine to hose out the containers with tap but I wouldn't do that to the media.

      My showers aren't getting nearly the flow they potentially could but a lot is the limitation of how much I can put over them and how much I can return. The media volume could handle a lot more though.

      Still learning as I go but y'all can call me Marilyn

    19. #19
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      Quote Originally Posted by CeD_^ View Post
      I am also planning to put a sand filter of 100kg before the shower. what capacity should the pump be with regards to the sand filter AND the shower?
      Nobody has addressed this question yet, so I will answer it with another question, just for clarification's sake - What type of "sand filter" are you referring to - a pressurized "swimming pool" type or a sand/gravel filter? If the former, I wouldn't even think of it on a pond. It will clog within an hour or so. If the latter, the are pump FED and gravity RETURN, so they really won't work BEFORE a shower unit.

      Also, no one has yet to mention the Zakki shower units. They're single box units that are custom made and include the Cermedia ceramic media. Depending on pond size, fish/feed load, they can be built to handle flow rates of anything from 3500-over 11000gph flow. The media has over 100,000sq ft of surface area per cubic foot. This allows for a very compact footprint. Go to the Vendor MarketPlace and look under Deepwater Koi Innovations for lots more info.

      Mike
      Mike

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    20. #20
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      Quote Originally Posted by Loco4Koi View Post
      Can one use pumice instead of feather rock and will that be better than lava rock?
      NO! Pumice is to soft and will erode away from the water flow.

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