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    Thread: how did i do? kohaku and shiro utsuri

    1. #1
      milaut is offline Senior Member
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      how did i do? kohaku and shiro utsuri

      hello everyone, i just purchased this kohaku at 14.5". can anyone give me some insight on how this one will turn out? i'm a noob at picking koi, but i liked the pattern and it fell w/in my price range. also, i'm bidding on this shiro utsuri at 12.4". i've heard that shiros take 3-4 to finish, so i have no idea how to choose a nice one. all help is appreciated. serious critique is welcome . thanks.
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    2. #2
      Ethan25's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by milaut View Post
      hello everyone, i just purchased this kohaku at 14.5". can anyone give me some insight on how this one will turn out? i'm a noob at picking koi, but i liked the pattern and it fell w/in my price range. also, i'm bidding on this shiro utsuri at 12.4". i've heard that shiros take 3-4 to finish, so i have no idea how to choose a nice one. all help is appreciated. serious critique is welcome . thanks.
      The kohaku looks as though it is a year to two from being finished. It's beni looks thick to me, but even so, there is a chance that near finished beni will begin to break up fairly quickly. That is what happened with my most recent kohaku purchase. I could be wrong though.
      Ephesians 2:8-9
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    3. #3
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      I think the shiro holds more for you than the kohaku. THe shiro's sumi is nice, it looks to be a male based on the yellow head, but that isn't ever a clear indicator. Both of these fish will give you instant gratification in your pond for sure. I don't know that they will be there for the long haul though.

      Ethan
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    4. #4
      milaut is offline Senior Member
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      Quote Originally Posted by Ethan25 View Post
      The kohaku looks as though it is a year to two from being finished. It's beni looks thick to me, but even so, there is a chance that near finished beni will begin to break up fairly quickly. That is what happened with my most recent kohaku purchase. I could be wrong though.

      I think the shiro holds more for you than the kohaku. THe shiro's sumi is nice, it looks to be a male based on the yellow head, but that isn't ever a clear indicator. Both of these fish will give you instant gratification in your pond for sure. I don't know that they will be there for the long haul though.

      Ethan
      thanks Ethan. i was hoping the beni would break up on the kohaku. instant gratification is great for me! i'm impatient. is there a way to tell how the sumi will fill in later on the shiro? thanks for the input.

    5. #5
      Just Jessie's Avatar
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      I think they both show NO promise at all and you should rehome them with me instantly and start over.
      .
      Just kidding, I like them both. Especially the shiro. They both have a nice body shape and clean white skin. The shiro has more sumi to come and I think will be a stunning fish.
      If the beni on the kohaku breaks up, you could have a very nicely balanced 5 step pattern. You done good


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    6. #6
      milaut is offline Senior Member
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      Quote Originally Posted by Just Jessie View Post
      I think they both show NO promise at all and you should rehome them with me instantly and start over.
      .
      Just kidding, I like them both. Especially the shiro. They both have a nice body shape and clean white skin. The shiro has more sumi to come and I think will be a stunning fish.
      If the beni on the kohaku breaks up, you could have a very nicely balanced 5 step pattern. You done good
      yay!!! i like to think i know a thing or two when it comes to selecting koi, but the truth is....i don't know jack . my gf and i could only agree on the kohaku . thanks for the critique.

    7. #7
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      where did you get them , if you don't mind my asking?


      Jessie
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    8. #8
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      Quote Originally Posted by Just Jessie View Post
      where did you get them , if you don't mind my asking?
      got them on kodama's website. i'm a frugal ponder. diy pond and filtration. i'm going to bid on a few more kois from the site to fully utilize the 4 kois/box shipping this is fun!

    9. #9
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      Quote Originally Posted by milaut View Post
      got them on kodama's website. i'm a frugal ponder. diy pond and filtration. i'm going to bid on a few more kois from the site to fully utilize the 4 kois/box shipping this is fun!
      OK, now you are HOOKED
      Keep in mind your pond size, and don't overload your filtration. A few healthy ones are better the a bunch you have to keep fighting to keep healthy.


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    10. #10
      milaut is offline Senior Member
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      Quote Originally Posted by Just Jessie View Post
      OK, now you are HOOKED
      Keep in mind your pond size, and don't overload your filtration. A few healthy ones are better the a bunch you have to keep fighting to keep healthy.
      Jessie, i've been hooked. it first started w/ pond building. Steve Joneli and the guys over at the contruction forum got me thinking i could diy ALL-BY-MYSELF . now that i've conquered that hurdle, i'm sooo ready to stock my pond. yes, i need to make sure i do not overload my filtration.

    11. #11
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      I do not like the kohaku b/c of the mado aki and kokesuki, the beni looks weak b/c of this. The SU is OK but not enough sumi in the back half, no zubon.

    12. #12
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      On the kohaku, I've heard that beni on the pecs can indicate strong beni. Sometimes as the fish grows, the beni is pulled up closer to the body of the fish which is a good thing.
      I bought a little Hoshikin male kohaku from Kodama. He had a bit of beni in the joint of the pec, like yours. That darned beni is so strong it is actually creeping down the pec, not a good thing.
      I like the body on the kohaku, nice strong tail tube. It'll be a fun one to watch.
      But listen to Flounder as that's experience talking.
      Still learning as I go but y'all can call me Marilyn

    13. #13
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      I like the Kohaku and agree with Jesse that when the fish get bigger and the beni seperates it will look nice.

      As far as the window is concerned, I would suspect that the beni will pull back, opening that window from the right side.

      Kokesuki? I don't see it, unless your refering to the madoaki

      I also like the balance of the shiroji on the nose and the odome. I think the kuragake is nice as well.

      I agree that the balance of the sumi on the SU is off, if more comes up on the back 1/3rd of the fish it will balance out.

      Not a fan of the all black pecs, but if it pulls back it will be an improvement

      Just my

    14. #14
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      Quote Originally Posted by Scrmnkg View Post
      As far as the window is concerned, I would suspect that the beni will pull back, opening that window from the right side.
      You mean kirekomi in the future? I highly doubt it.

      Quote Originally Posted by Scrmnkg View Post
      Kokesuki? I don't see it, unless your refering to the madoaki

      I also like the balance of the shiroji on the nose and the odome. I think the kuragake is nice as well.
      The resolution on the original pic is not much so I could not blow it up more to show the details circled. Need a better pic.

      Kuragake? I don't know about that, more like ichimatsu for this area.
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      As with many that view this forum, I'm still learning alot So I have to say I don't know what "kirekomi" is?

      I blew the photo up as well and the resolution does get very poor, but I do see your areas of concern.

      Please correct me if I'm wrong, like I said I'm learning, isn't "ichimatsu" more of a checkerboard pattern that you would want on a Utsuri? With "kuragake" being a saddle shaped pattern?

    16. #16
      milaut is offline Senior Member
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      Quote Originally Posted by Scrmnkg View Post
      As with many that view this forum, I'm still learning alot So I have to say I don't know what "kirekomi" is?

      I blew the photo up as well and the resolution does get very poor, but I do see your areas of concern.

      Please correct me if I'm wrong, like I said I'm learning, isn't "ichimatsu" more of a checkerboard pattern that you would want on a Utsuri? With "kuragake" being a saddle shaped pattern?

      wow y'all, this is . i have no idea what these terms mean, but i'm looking them up as we speak. i didn't pay a fortune for these, so i'm not expecting . just wanted to have the pond stocked, so that my parents could enjoy watching the different types of kois. i love the critique'n....so that maybe i will do better the next time around. thanks all.

    17. #17
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      I like the body structure on the Kohaku. The Shiro will have a typical Utsuri body with a thin tail tube. The Kohaku will end up with a Nidan or Sandan pattern at best. I don't understand where people get the idea that a Kohaku's beni pattern will "break up"!? As the sashi develops a cleaner look based on the thickening of the shiroji and the growth of the fish, a bit more shiroji will be visible between the hi plates. It just depends on the type of kiwa the fish has as well (maruzome or kamisori) and whether the beni will tighten to the fore-scale or spread to fill in the existing colored scale.

      The Shiro is male and carries no interest for me as the pattern balance just won't be there.

      Marilyn, I know exactly what you're saying about Hoshikin Kohaku. On his fish, I personally have a supposedly high quality jumbo tosai I purchased in spring of last year. It had a bit of beni in the pec as well. Now it has secondary beni on both cheek plates and in the tail. Yes, on some fish it represents strong beni, but to what extent and what exactly that means has now become a question in my mind for what it holds for the future.

      Mike

    18. #18
      Marilyn's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by koiman1950 View Post
      ... Marilyn, I know exactly what you're saying about Hoshikin Kohaku. On his fish, I personally have a supposedly high quality jumbo tosai I purchased in spring of last year. It had a bit of beni in the pec as well. Now it has secondary beni on both cheek plates and in the tail. Yes, on some fish it represents strong beni, but to what extent and what exactly that means has now become a question in my mind for what it holds for the future.

      Mike
      Thanks Mike, I figure he will stay with me for at least this season. He's a gorgeous 3 step and thankfully hasn't popped any unexpected beni elsewhere. Plus he was one of my very first purchases and I'm attached to the little guy. By the end of the season, the kohaku I got from Russ for the mud might oust him to a new home though.
      Still learning as I go but y'all can call me Marilyn

    19. #19
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      Quote Originally Posted by Marilyn View Post
      Thanks Mike, I figure he will stay with me for at least this season. He's a gorgeous 3 step and thankfully hasn't popped any unexpected beni elsewhere. Plus he was one of my very first purchases and I'm attached to the little guy. By the end of the season, the kohaku I got from Russ for the mud might oust him to a new home though.
      Ah, so you have something for the mud spa this year, eh?! I just sent Russ my check for my two to go back for another treatment. If it's any indication from last year's growth, it should be a rather fun October. Are you going to the BBQ next Sunday?

      Mike

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      Marilyn's Avatar
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      Yes indeed, should be fun.
      I picked up a couple, oh ok three. I hope to learn a lot from them. My mud fish will probably be doing what your's is doing and making return trips.
      Still learning as I go but y'all can call me Marilyn

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