How long do you qt new fish? Do you medicate the water? Do you raise the temp? Do you have multiple quarantine tanks?
How long do you qt new fish? Do you medicate the water? Do you raise the temp? Do you have multiple quarantine tanks?
-- Carl --
I have two protocols.
I am well and truly cross-contaminated with Brett's fish. So fish I steal from him - four days. I treat for flukes (fluke tabs), costia (malachite green and formalin) and trichodina (pp) because those are inescapable here.
Outside fish I use a ONE YEAR quarantine. They go into a q-tank with "Fugly" the designated canary. I see them through hot water and cold water, and get to watch them grow.
"To bosom friend, to gracious host
To those who fall, and those who lift
To those who give, yet mark not gift
To healing, hope, and circumstance
To faith, to fate, to meetings chance"
-Bob Kublin (who I have not met)
I salt dip any incoming fish. Then treat anything that comes up. Depending on what time of year I get them determines how long they stay in Q... 4 months is a minimum at 70*+ ... so if get them in the fall.... it's all winter till several months into Spring.
sarah
It's not about the storms we endure, it's about learning to dance in the rain! (even when it's INSIDE your house)
North Florida Koi Club
www.koihealth.org
http://www.koistuff.com
Where there's grass.... there's room for pond...
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Salt new one's and watch...keep canary in for company
If warm water wait about 4-6 weeks
if cold temps wait till spring and warmer water...no heat cycling as of yet
We have two qt tanks...one is 1000gal and other is1800 gal...large enough for extended stays if necessary
To those that q for long periods of time, is that indoors? If so, what do you do for lighting so you can maintain color?
Personally I have one Q-tank about 1,000 gallons. I keep two fish in there all the time to keep the filters cycled and as dither fish with new arrivals. I usually put a new fish in, let her rest for a few days, then scrape and scope. If I find nothing, she stays there for 6-8 weeks. If I find a parasite, I treat accordingly.
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Sue
Let's say I QT the fishies for couple months.. monitor carefully... heated the tank to 70* or so. During and after couple months... no sign of sickness, healthy looking fishies. Am I assume that's OK to put into the rest of the koi in the main pond? Do I need to do the KHV test?
Kevin D.
I'm going to try to get some more responses to this thread. This is an important subject and I would appreciate a little more info.
What is the proper protocol regarding khv? Obviously, testing is the best option, but what is the procedure regarding heating the qt to induce its emergence if it's there? To what temp should the qt be heated and for how long? Does it really make any sense to qt and not try to deal with the khv issue?
I was thinking of having two 350 gallon qts and maybe one 1k gallon qt. Do any of you have multiple qts?
-- Carl --
if the new fish is worth more than you collection... no need.
IF your collection is valuable... EACH of them as well as the new fish should be tested.
sarah
It's not about the storms we endure, it's about learning to dance in the rain! (even when it's INSIDE your house)
North Florida Koi Club
www.koihealth.org
http://www.koistuff.com
Where there's grass.... there's room for pond...
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I have posted before but it is gone now....this info is from a email from Vicki Vaughan to me over at UG.
An adequate QT system is no longer a "nice" thing to have for the average koi keeper- it is a necessity if one plans to add fish to their collection. The most important issue to address is temperature. KHV and SVC will only break at the permissive tempertures. SVC at 55-65 and KHV at 70-75 F. SVC is really not that prevalent and no one is going to test for it anyway. If you add fish on a regular basis it is a good idea to keep a tank running with sentinel fish in it to keep the biological filtration active. A key point for QT is that it is MUCH easier and less expensive to treat a 200 gallon QT tank than a 10,000 gallon pond.
Salt (0.3%)added to the tank will lessen the stress on the fish by making it easier to osmoregulate (let me know if I need to explain that) and incresing slime coat. I like to use Solar Salt that is found with the water softeners at Lowes. It is an evaporated sea salt.
After fish have settled down then scrape and gill clip to assess for parasites and treat accordingly. I like formalin/malachite green combinations. Dimilin for crustacial (is that a word?) involvement.
Time
The incubation period for KHV is 7 to 14 days at the permissive temp. So I would QT for 1 month if you can maintain that temp.
We (UGA Diagnostic Lab) also have a serological (blood) test that can detect antibody levels in the fish. In other words we can determine a carrier or a fish that has been exposed to KHV. It takes a fish 2 weeks to produce antibodies so this test is not valid if they have been recently exposed.
It requires 100 ul (microliters) (one tenth of a milliliter or cc) of serum. It is necessary to draw blood from the fish and then spin down the red blood cells. If the cells are left in then they hemolyse and negate the test.
Always net the tank- not a question of WHETHER an fish will jump out rather WHEN Test water quality parameters often and do water changes when necessary Also a good idea to add a fish from the original collection to the QT tank an monitor for a couple of weeks o see if there are any problems.
I have a commercial koi farm and I QT new broodstock for one year and blood test them- overkill but I have too much to lose Important to have QT tank AWAY from the original collection and that effluent from tank will not run into pond (I know this seems obvious but I have seen too much) Separate nets and testing equipment for tank and pond Dechlor when doing water changes One dealer incubates naive fish (never been exposed to
Virus) with his import fish for one month at permissive temp and then sacrifices those fish for the PCR (polymerase chain
reaction) test.
no. but the point is... KHV carriers may be in the pond already... it doesn't break for carriers unless the fish are really stressed.
an expensive fish that may break and kill the heard is a chance some may be willing to take...unfortunately...
The entire herd needs to be tested before fish of that caliber goes in. It's about 20 bucks a head. then any carriers can be rooted out and the pond ket KHV free.
sarah
It's not about the storms we endure, it's about learning to dance in the rain! (even when it's INSIDE your house)
North Florida Koi Club
www.koihealth.org
http://www.koistuff.com
Where there's grass.... there's room for pond...
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Joking aside, those are good points. My pond temp was at least 80 degrees for four weeks this summer. Is that good enough, or should I still have the inhabitants tested?
Actually, I am building a new pond this spring and starting another in the fall. Maybe I just won't put her in with the rest. But, if I was going to, would I really need to test all the other fish given the temps I had this summer?
-- Carl --
Cliff notes version.... Good QT Tank, with a 6 week minumim Quarantine period, Prefer 3 months plus, if I can stand it... ... I used to raise temp for KHV.. now no longer, as I would rather find out early than later... Treat for any bugs at 3 days if found, and as need during the period. Water condition starts at what they came from, raising slowly to 75F for most of the period...Canary koi in early also.
Hope that helps
Best Regards,
Bob Winkler
I have one fibreglass, permanent q tank that is 1,000 gallons. The overflow pipe is calibrated so that its right at that volume all the time. That's fugly's home. As need arises I can put up as many as seven vinyl (Pearls of Paradise) show tanks to use as a quarantine facility.
We do this pretty regularly because we have to annually drain and dry the mudponds. The fish have to be housed in qtanks until the ponds can be refilled. When we do this we fill the garage AND backyard. I have a separate water supply and air supply for quarantine.
For the one year quarantine, no, I don't add heat intentionally - our weather goes about 90 degrees reliably in the summer, and we get several months of "cooking".
So a one year quarantine takes the fish through the temperature cycling to "test" for KHV.
KHV is the scariest thing I've seen in this hobby. I'm very reluctant to add new fish right now because of it. The last fish I added from a source other than Brett went through the full one year quarantine.
I'm not convinced that even a one year quarantine really tells you everything you need to know. But its the best I can do.
"To bosom friend, to gracious host
To those who fall, and those who lift
To those who give, yet mark not gift
To healing, hope, and circumstance
To faith, to fate, to meetings chance"
-Bob Kublin (who I have not met)
This is good stuff keep it coming
Originally Posted by SDKoiman
The incubation period for KHV is 7 to 14 days at the permissive temp. So I would QT for 1 month if you can maintain that temp.
We (UGA Diagnostic Lab) also have a serological (blood) test that can detect antibody levels in the fish. In other words we can determine a carrier or a fish that has been exposed to KHV. It takes a fish 2 weeks to produce antibodies so this test is not valid if they have been recently exposed.
It requires 100 ul (microliters) (one tenth of a milliliter or cc) of serum. It is necessary to draw blood from the fish and then spin down the red blood cells. If the cells are left in then they hemolyse and negate the test.
One dealer incubates naive fish (never been exposed to
Virus) with his import fish for one month at permissive temp and then sacrifices those fish for the PCR (polymerase chain
reaction) test.
KHV Questions
Does anyone have experience with these tests?
How and where do you go to get these tests?
Quarantine Questions
I have never chemically treated any fish without knowing what I am treating.
Savanna stated (I treat for flukes (fluke tabs), costia (malachite green and formalin) and trichodina (pp) because those are inescapable here.)
Should this be a standard for new fish added to a Qtank?
Fill with water Qt temp is at 70-77 over time..Watch at first, scrape for bugs, treat as needed, watch more, QT is from 2-4 months..
Marie
Marie
Have You Hugged Your Koi Today Ruby's Keeper
Only if needed Thats why we have a scope. Salt to 1 is fine but I am not sure why I have learned the hard way to be careful with meds and treat for what they sick from..Shot gunning is a last resort but sometimes needed..Your DR. wouldn't give you med's if she/he didn't know what's wrong..Find it and treat it Wash hands and tools/nets etc if more than 1 QT !!
Marie
Marie
Have You Hugged Your Koi Today Ruby's Keeper