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View Full Version : Sharing pics of my Fry...



Cindy_AL
05-12-2009, 08:18 PM
Im not real good at getting good clear pictures of something this small but here goes...

I have about 250-300 babies separated into 4 different tanks. They are mostly sorted by size. The fry hatched about 2 1/2 wks ago. I purchased the eggs and was told they would be a mix of standard & butterfly.

Cindy_AL
05-12-2009, 08:20 PM
more.....

Cindy_AL
05-12-2009, 08:22 PM
Of course this first picture is one of my "tobies". I have about 4 which are in an aquarium with a few more that are slightly smaller.

stephen
05-12-2009, 08:26 PM
:wee_hee::wee_hee::punk1::yahoo:

DebbieKSW
05-12-2009, 08:30 PM
Good fun..thanks for the photos.

Cindy_AL
05-12-2009, 08:35 PM
Im still amazed when I look at these pictures comparing the development of the Tobie & the other babies. Im ready to throw Tobie in the pond and see if he will take care of the frog that we cant get rid of.

I do have a question about Tobies... When you remove one from the tank, will another fish just take his place?

stephen
05-12-2009, 08:47 PM
Im still amazed when I look at these pictures comparing the development of the Tobie & the other babies. Im ready to throw Tobie in the pond and see if he will take care of the frog that we cant get rid of.

I do have a question about Tobies... When you remove one from the tank, will another fish just take his place?

Good question Cindy.:cool3: Just my observations but, I think initally about 1 out of 20 fry are tobies. I just recently had a spawn almost 4 weeks ago. http://www.koiphen.com/forums/showthread.php?t=94755 I spend a lot of time just watching the tobies. All day long they just sneak upon the little ones and try to inhale them. To answer your question IMHO, anytime one is large enough to eat a sibling, they will do so. I think I now have 10% tobies in my current fry population. I haven't bothered to remove any because the spawn produced so many.

Disclaimer: If I become reincarnated as a koi fry, I hope that I am a Tobie:punk1::punk1::clap::yahoo::cheer::yes::cool:

Cindy_AL
05-12-2009, 09:45 PM
I love your black & white koi. (I havent learned all the proper names for each breed yet) But thats on my wish list! Hoping that maybe one of my fry will be black & white. Guess I have a LONG time to wait & find out. :(

BTW... after spending days reading all that we could on this site, last weekend we removed about 3/4 of the rock from our pond. We worked so hard to try to make it look more "natural" & to hide the liner. We just built it last summer. Was shocked at all of the sludge hidden between all of the rocks. It did free up alot of space as well. We are still working on placing the flat rocks around the perimeter. We want for the rocks to slightly hang over the edge as to make the liner less noticeable. But that makes the rock less stable if I step on it. Is there a better way to secure the flat rocks in place?

We also have 2 other ponds dug out and about to get started on those soon. One will be about 15,000-17,000 gal & the other about 2000-3000 gal. The big liner is being delivered later this week. :D:

mmzullo
05-13-2009, 09:08 AM
Cindy,
I never thought about buying eggs. Good idea. On the slate. I think the best is too get bigger pieces. Good luck with the fry. Keep us updated on the progress.
Mike

CHICHI
05-13-2009, 09:42 AM
I love your black & white koi. (I havent learned all the proper names for each breed yet) But thats on my wish list! Hoping that maybe one of my fry will be black & white. Guess I have a LONG time to wait & find out. :(

BTW... after spending days reading all that we could on this site, last weekend we removed about 3/4 of the rock from our pond. We worked so hard to try to make it look more "natural" & to hide the liner. We just built it last summer. Was shocked at all of the sludge hidden between all of the rocks. It did free up alot of space as well. We are still working on placing the flat rocks around the perimeter. We want for the rocks to slightly hang over the edge as to make the liner less noticeable. But that makes the rock less stable if I step on it. Is there a better way to secure the flat rocks in place?

We also have 2 other ponds dug out and about to get started on those soon. One will be about 15,000-17,000 gal & the other about 2000-3000 gal. The big liner is being delivered later this week. :D:


Cindy do Post your New Pond Build/Design Plans/Measurments in the Pond Construction Forum :yes: You will receive all the assistance you might need with these there :D:

Tobies should be Seperated promptly :eek1: or they will continue Cannibalising their Siblings :eek1:

Cindy_AL
05-13-2009, 10:05 AM
I had to transfer 2 more tobies this morning from one tank to the "Tobie tank". They are not as big as my biggest tobies but were a good bit larger than the other fry in that tank. So I now have about 12 fish in the Tobie tank.

Thank you for the suggestion, Chichi.
Because we live on a mountain, its quite a challenge to do any landscaping. Our whole backyard is a work in progress... so many projects started but we plan for it all to fit together into one big backyard getaway when it is finished. We always have to consider the run-off and have french drains everywhere. Its also full of rocks & boulders. We held our breath when we dug out the 2 new ponds. Thankfully there were no rocks that were too big to move. (though we did hit one of our field lines)

I will start taking pictures. It would be really nice to have some good input and suggestions from others with experience.

Super Kindai
05-13-2009, 10:43 AM
Hi,
The fry look good and healthy.
the yellowish fry in the light blue containers look like Kohaku and possibly few sanke (3 colored koi).
It looks to me that the orange colored Toby has longer fins than standard fins.
then.... Are these real color of the " Green eyes" fry in the pinkish container??? :eek1: I have never seen like that before.


>I do have a question about Tobies... When you remove one from the tank, will another fish just take his place?

There are a couple reasons why Tobies appear among other fry.

1) a scarcity of food in an environment. (fry look for food 24/7, not like us 3 times a day)
2) a fry inherited more primitive type gene which is more wild and stronger than others.

It is said that 99.9% + of Tobies turn NOT good enough as Nshikigoi. On the other hand, If a Toby has an excellent quality and reasonably pattern accidentally, it becomes a precious candidate of parental fish of next generation for professional breeders.

Cindy_AL
05-13-2009, 11:54 AM
They dont really have green eyes. I guess its from the flash. :lol: They look like alien fish.

I thought the tobie looked to have a longer fin too. It really looks healthy though. Its probably about 1" long. So they usually turn out to be uglies?

Next question: Do tobies eventually reach an age that they dont try to eat the smaller fish?

CHICHI
05-13-2009, 12:49 PM
They dont really have green eyes. I guess its from the flash. :lol: They look like alien fish.

I thought the tobie looked to have a longer fin too. It really looks healthy though. Its probably about 1" long. So they usually turn out to be uglies?

Next question: Do tobies eventually reach an age that they dont try to eat the smaller fish?

Only when there are no smaller Fish left to eat :eek1: Wiser to keep same size Fry together :yes: and even then I have had equal size Siblings kill weaker Fry :eek1:

Shorty
05-13-2009, 01:08 PM
Thanks for the pictures !! Really enjoy them.

I got in the habit of completely draining my fry tank once every 2 weeks to sort out the tobies. Had to make sure the tank was COMPLETELY empty including the muck at the bottom, otherwise the tobies would hide down there in the bottom and continue to eat more of their siblings.

I too have the opinion that tobies are unlikely to to have good coloration, BUT, they are very fast growers and continue to grow faster than their smaller siblings when they get older, and seem to be "friendlier" fish more eager to eat from your hand. So, you might consider keeping some of them for their personality.

Shorty

Super Kindai
05-13-2009, 01:20 PM
They dont really have green eyes. I guess its from the flash. :lol: They look like alien fish.

I thought the tobie looked to have a longer fin too. It really looks healthy though. Its probably about 1" long. So they usually turn out to be uglies?

Next question: Do tobies eventually reach an age that they dont try to eat the smaller fish?

Oh, When I looked at "Green" aliens, I thought you got a new variety..(!!??) that pro-breeders have never been achieved.:D:

Actually, Tobie's fin of standard koi usually looks a bit shorter compared with body length because body grows so rapidly while fin's growth can't catch up with.:yes:

It's not an age but a matter of different sizes each others. a 6"koi won't (can't) eat a 3" koi, for instance but a 1" fry will be eaten and a 10-12" koi can eat a few inches koi if a bigger one is hungry.....something like that.:eek1:

Cindy_AL
05-13-2009, 01:21 PM
Im not in any hurry to get rid of my tobies.. as long as I have a place to keep them separate from the rest of the fry. They will be the first to be placed in my pond as my guinea pigs when they get bigger.

I actually have fry in my pond now but Im thinking they are probably comets. I have comets, 3 shubunkins & eight koi. (which range in size from approx 5"-8") The fry in the pond have lots of places to hide so Im sure they will do fine once they are alittle bigger.

Cindy_AL
05-13-2009, 01:25 PM
Oh, When I looked at "Green" aliens, I thought you got a new variety..(!!??) that pro-breeders have never been achieved.:D:

Actually, Tobie's fin of standard koi usually looks a bit shorter compared with body length because body grows so rapidly while fin's growth can't catch up with.:yes:

It's not an age but a matter of different sizes each others. a 6"koi won't (can't) eat a 3" koi, for instance but a 1" fry will be eaten and a 10-12" koi can eat a few inches koi if a bigger one is hungry.....something like that.:eek1:


I knew that my koi have never bothered my comets. (though I almost wish they would sometimes)
I guess Im more concerned about the visiting bullfrogs & all of the hawks in the area.

CHICHI
05-13-2009, 01:28 PM
I knew that my koi have never bothered my comets. (though I almost wish they would sometimes)
I guess Im more concerned about the visiting bullfrogs & all of the hawks in the area.

Even worse still is when left in with their Siblings Tobies tend to eat all the Prettier Fry First :eek1: :eek1:

Koijazz
05-13-2009, 02:15 PM
How big are your regular sized fry?

Cindy_AL
05-13-2009, 03:17 PM
most are 1/2" to 3/4". Theres a few who are smaller though. From what I have read, I guess I shouldnt expect those to be as healthy or maybe even to survive... kind of like the "runts" of the litter.

Super Kindai
05-14-2009, 04:06 AM
most are 1/2" to 3/4". Theres a few who are smaller though. From what I have read, I guess I shouldnt expect those to be as healthy or maybe even to survive... kind of like the "runts" of the litter.
It may be an incredible story, but often treasures are hidden in the runts of the litter....:yes:

Cindy_AL
05-22-2009, 10:48 AM
My fry started hatching 4 wks ago today so I guess I may have some that are officially a month old.
I took a few pictures of my Tobies this morning. There is one in particular that I have been watching. Most of the others are a very light goldish color (like the pictures I posted earlier in this thread) but this one looks alittle darker and has dark fins. I like the way he looks compared to the other Tobies.
Here's a few pics.. the first 2 are of the darker Tobie & the other is the lighter colored.

As far as the other tanks, I have found a few dead ones at the bottom of the tanks. (maybe 1 or 2 from each tank) I am assuming this is a normal occurance and all the rest seem fine. Its hard to appreciate much growth at this point. I am so ready to throw a filter on the tanks to decrease the number of water changes. Its getting old real fast... especially when I have alot of other things going on.

Cindy_AL
05-22-2009, 08:15 PM
a few more fry pictures...

Cindy_AL
05-24-2009, 01:14 PM
There are from the tanks that are in the garage without a heater... they seem to be quite a bit smaller.

Super Kindai
05-24-2009, 05:13 PM
I think that you will get some decent looking ones from these smaller fry.

Cindy_AL
05-24-2009, 05:41 PM
I think that you will get some decent looking ones from these smaller fry.

I was concerned because they are still so small after a month.

I know I need more patience. :yes:

Of the last pics that I posted, is there a certain pattern that i should be looking for? I noticed that they are getting some dark areas or spots. Or are the solid yellow ones that hold more promise?

Super Kindai
05-24-2009, 07:55 PM
It is said that generally fry grow 1mm ( .04 - .05 inch) per a day, if there are enough food around them. So, newly born fry are supposed to reach 1.5+ inches after a month or so. (there is different growth rate among koi variety though, for instance, kohaku fry grow faster than showa fry, etc.)

The fry in the last pics that you posted are still too small to see a certain pattern, although we can see a quality of the colors.
these dark spots become sumi marking so that most likely they will be Sanke and/or aka bekko. then the solid yellow ones turn to be Kohaku or Higoi (= plain red/orange colored koi) as I mentioned before. Once the fry reach to 1.0 - 1.5 inches, then you can see pattern something like a white nose, white tail joint area, step pattern or just plain pattern without showing any white ground, etc.
**the more fry grow, the more an amount of food is needed to grow properly.

Cindy_AL
05-24-2009, 11:11 PM
Apparently the plants that my koi eggs came attached to also had snails. At first there were no visible snails in the aquarium then all of a sudden they were reproducing like crazy. They do help to keep the tank cleaner.
Anyway, I wasnt really paying much attn to the snails but then just noticed this morning that they have laid eggs all over. (they are in the Tobie tank) Now the fish are eating the eggs. Is this ok? Could this be one of the reasons why they are so much bigger? They have been given the same food as all of my other tanks. I have never seen any of the "Tobies" actually eat any of their siblings. I have just tried to keep the fry grouped according to size.

Super Kindai
05-26-2009, 02:33 AM
Apparently the plants that my koi eggs came attached to also had snails. At first there were no visible snails in the aquarium then all of a sudden they were reproducing like crazy. They do help to keep the tank cleaner.
Anyway, I wasnt really paying much attn to the snails but then just noticed this morning that they have laid eggs all over. (they are in the Tobie tank) Now the fish are eating the eggs. Is this ok? Could this be one of the reasons why they are so much bigger? They have been given the same food as all of my other tanks. I have never seen any of the "Tobies" actually eat any of their siblings. I have just tried to keep the fry grouped according to size.
As far as I know, eating snail eggs is no problem at all.
the reason why some of fry turn to be Tobies is, as I mentioned before, lack of abundant food in an environment of the growing pond. Ideally, there should be food at all the time 24/7.
There are always slightly bigger, aggressive, and wild character' fry that would swim better and faster... so they could get food faster than smaller, weaker, and shy ones. a slight deferent size of fry at an early period makes big differences between them.
Koi is an omnivorous animal which means they are a carnivorous too. Once bigger & strong fry eat a smaller & weaker fry because of starvation, then they learn that there are abundant nutritionally perfect food, smaller fry, around them instead of waiting for feeding time by us.

Hirogoi
05-26-2009, 03:31 AM
Nice pics! You may honestly want to try a few small filters now. I slapped one on my fantail fry after a few days and just wrapped some stocking mesh around it. As long as it's not too strong you'll be okay.

CHICHI
05-26-2009, 04:15 AM
:yes: I installed the small Air run Combined Sponge/Charcoal and Zeolite Filters to my Fry Tank at the end of the first Week :yes: you can cover the Grid with stocking Material :yes:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/PENN-PLAX-SWF1C-REPLACEMENT-FILTERS-6X2-Pack_W0QQitemZ160291973673QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Pe t_Supplies_Fish?hash=item2552256a29&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A2108%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C 240%3A1318%7C301%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50

Cindy_AL
05-26-2009, 06:50 AM
I increased the amount of food yesterday. I thought maybe I was not feeding them enough. I kept reading how important it is not to overfeed... Its hard to know whats "enough" with this ground up food. I also added freeze dried bloodworms, krill & baby shrimp. I ground it all up together.

I also began another "experiment" yesterday. I bought one of those large mesh pop-up laundry baskets and put it in the pond with a rock in the bottom to hold it in place. The holes are not big enough for the fry to get out of. I put about 5 fish in it to see how they do. We have really good water movement in the pond with lots of algae attached to plants & stuff for the fry to eat. Theres about 10 goldfish fry that survived 4 Quick Cure treatments, about 75% drainage of the pond and removal of about 70% of the rocks. They are growing really fast.

Im alittle concerned about the koi fry growth because I thought for sure that they would be big enough to go into the pond by 10-12 wks of age. We will be going out of town the first week of July and I wont have anyone to take care of them if they are still inside. I suppose I could move the tanks outside but it gets awful hot in July. Guess I will have to wait till closer to that time and see how they progress.

As far as the filters... I only have 2 ten gal aquariums with about 10-12 fry in each. The 2 rubbermaid containers in the garage are 55 gal (with about 50 fry) & approx 30 gal (with about 40 fry). They all have air sticks. I assume I would use a 10 gal filter on the aquariums but I dont know what I could do with the ones in the rubbermaid containers.
Any suggestions?

Super Kindai
05-26-2009, 01:02 PM
Allow me to post a few pictures for your reference.

the countless tiny live Daphnia available 24/7 for fry and they are self-reproduction and don't make water dirty.
few fry in this kind of the environment turn to Tobie.

Hirogoi
05-26-2009, 02:27 PM
How many gallons of water do you provide for each spawn?

Cindy_AL
05-26-2009, 03:27 PM
I do not have koi big enough to breed so havent had to deal with spawning yet. (except with the goldfish) I purchased the eggs from a breeder. Our pond is almost 4000 gal. which will become our goldfish pond when we complete the ponds we are presently building. Our large pond will be between 16,000-20,000. We are also adding a smaller pond for spawning, raising fry or for QT. It will be around 2000 gal.

Cindy_AL
06-14-2009, 03:28 PM
Just an update on my fry...

I lost some fry here & there over the past few wks. No big die off or obvious cause of death. I suppose I have about 75-85 left at this point. about 50 are in the pond kept in the mesh baskets. They are growing much better with more food available. I still have 2 aquariums inside with the smaller ones. It helped to be able to add the filters so I dont have to do so many water changes.
Yesterday I removed the babies from the pond baskets and took a few pictures. I separated them again by size. Was really surprised by the size of the tobies. Since I am new to this, I dont know if any show promise at this point. Will probably all be mutts but thats ok. Its fun to watch them grow & change.
Our goldfish babies are now changing colors. (they were all grayish-black until now) They have grown alot. I guess they are about 2-3" in size. They dont even hide from the koi anymore.

Heres some of the koi babies... would like some advise on any that I should or shouldnt cull.

Thanks!

Cindy_AL
06-14-2009, 03:30 PM
more....

Missa
06-14-2009, 03:34 PM
Is there a blue one in there?

Cindy_AL
06-14-2009, 03:38 PM
Thats what it looks like to me. Caught my eye immediately when I took it out. It was hard to demonstrate in the photos but glad you noticed. I was going to ask if that was a typical fry color. It has a hint of yellow on the pec fins as well.

Poppajohn
06-14-2009, 03:47 PM
I think I saw a blue one too. It looks cool and I would like one of my fry to look like that. Would be cool to watch and see how it turns out. Nice pics and looks like you are doing well with them. :clap:

Wish I had a nice supply of Daphnia like you do. I tried but was unable to get them going. I was probably going about it all wrong but eh. Oh and I just read that blue fry is very toxic to your other fry so you should send it to me right away. :yes: kidding of course :D:

Cindy_AL
06-14-2009, 03:52 PM
Thanks. Actually, there are 2 others that also have a blue tint. But not as bright as this one. I first noticed it last wk when I was feeding them. There are floating plants in the baskets so I dont get to see the babies much. I just feed them and move on to the larger fish. But the blue one came to the surface and I thought it was just a reflection. So I was pleasantly surprised when I took them out yesterday. I am looking fwd to seeing how it progresses. :yes:

Poppajohn
06-14-2009, 03:57 PM
It is so much fun raising fry. I really need to get the mud pond going for next year so I can really get some serious breeding done. I have so much fun doing it but I get a lot of grief from the rest of the family because I am spending too much time with the fry. Is this your first year with fry? If so you are doing great and the blue one is certainly a nice surprise or at least in my opinion. Would be cool if it kept most of the nice blue it has now. :cool:

Cindy_AL
06-14-2009, 04:06 PM
Yes, this is my first fry experience. We built our pond last summer but only had goldfish in it until Febuary. Thats when we bought our first koi. We have a total of 9 koi that are 5-8". We are presently building a much larger pond. (about 18,000 gal) It will be for the koi and the current pond (4000 gal) will only be for goldfish. We want to keep a good number of the babies along with our 9 koi.

Poppajohn
06-14-2009, 04:20 PM
Yes, this is my first fry experience. We built our pond last summer but only had goldfish in it until Febuary. Thats when we bought our first koi. We have a total of 9 koi that are 5-8". We are presently building a much larger pond. (about 18,000 gal) It will be for the koi and the current pond (4000 gal) will only be for goldfish. We want to keep a good number of the babies along with our 9 koi.

:cool::yahoo::clap:

Cindy_AL
06-15-2009, 08:12 PM
any suggestions in regards to culling? (please dont say cull all of them... I just cant)

Koijazz
06-17-2009, 12:57 PM
How old and big are the fry? Mine are about a month and a half and don't look anything like yours! Still around an inch and sold yellow or grayish black.

Cindy_AL
06-17-2009, 01:49 PM
How old and big are the fry? Mine are about a month and a half and don't look anything like yours! Still around an inch and sold yellow or grayish black.


Mine are about 6-7 wks old. They are 1-2" in size.

Super Kindai
06-20-2009, 12:04 AM
any suggestions in regards to culling? (please dont say cull all of them... I just cant)
Its depend on what you want to keep. the fry are big enough and are already showing a lot of a sing as for coloration, pattern even body structure. a few of them show deformity, short face/nose, etc.

Cindy_AL
06-20-2009, 10:32 AM
Its depend on what you want to keep. the fry are big enough and are already showing a lot of a sing as for coloration, pattern even body structure. a few of them show deformity, short face/nose, etc.

I was hoping that you would comment...

Can you show me which ones show deformity? I am not culling for a particular type... Im sure most (if not all) are mutts but I guess I really just wanted to know if any show promise for a decent coloration pattern. I seem to have alot that are black with yellow heads. Is that a common pattern?
I still have about 25-30 in the aquariums that are still pretty small. Most of those are white or yellow without signs of patterns yet.

Super Kindai
06-20-2009, 11:02 PM
As we can see, they are not a normal shape, aren't they?

Cindy_AL
06-21-2009, 08:56 AM
thank you for showing me. I will take them out & get a better look.

Any comment on the patterns? Not sure what I should be looking for at this age/size. I am not looking for any particular type. Just some that will look good.

Super Kindai
06-21-2009, 09:06 PM
Watching fry' growth is fun and interesting, isn't it? Once we grow them to tosai size, say 4-6 inches, usually we would be convinced that having good ones is very difficult since Marjory offspring are unacceptable as nishikigoi by its coloration and pattern.
Nobody else but your fry themselves are the best teachers for you......

however generally speaking, the plain brown colored ones, chagoi/soragoi/magoi group, won't change color and pattern. and also the plain orange ones, akamuji/higoi group, would most likely maintain that way in future.
it is said that if plain orange one have white belly, some of them might have a chance to making pattern later.... a little chance though. the plain white ones at this stage would also maintain like that.

then the three colored ones of this variety, Sanke, will change its appearance by reducing (tighten) amount of black (sumi). sometimes yellow/orange pattern are hiding under large patch black (sumi ) on body at this stage.
Lastly, I saw a couple of Blue color fry in the pictures, regular and Doitu scale, that I have never seen.... so, they are out of my imagination....interesting!! :D:

Cindy_AL
06-21-2009, 10:47 PM
Watching fry' growth is fun and interesting, isn't it? Once we grow them to tosai size, say 4-6 inches, usually we would be convinced that having good ones is very difficult since Marjory offspring are unacceptable as nishikigoi by its coloration and pattern.
Nobody else but your fry themselves are the best teachers for you......

however generally speaking, the plain brown colored ones, chagoi/soragoi/magoi group, won't change color and pattern. and also the plain orange ones, akamuji/higoi group, would most likely maintain that way in future.
it is said that if plain orange one have white belly, some of them might have a chance to making pattern later.... a little chance though. the plain white ones at this stage would also maintain like that.

then the three colored ones of this variety, Sanke, will change its appearance by reducing (tighten) amount of black (sumi). sometimes yellow/orange pattern are hiding under large patch black (sumi ) on body at this stage.
Lastly, I saw a couple of Blue color fry in the pictures, regular and Doitu scale, that I have never seen.... so, they are out of my imagination....interesting!! :D:

Thanks so much for explaining. Yes, it is fun to watch them change. It helps to know what to look for. I have several that are bluish colored. Im looking forward to watching them grow. :yes:

Cindy_AL
06-27-2009, 05:23 PM
Today I sorted the fry in the pond baskets again according to size & moved the rest of the babies from the indoor aquariums out to the pond baskets. Its always exciting when I sort them because I get a closer look at their growth & color changes. (I can hardly see them in the baskets.)
I am especially excited today as I think I see some bling coming out. :yahoo:

Here's some updated pictures:

Cindy_AL
06-27-2009, 05:25 PM
more......

Cindy_AL
06-27-2009, 05:26 PM
last ones...

Cindy_AL
06-27-2009, 05:37 PM
as you can see, the blue ones are still blue.... I think I have more that are smaller too.

Tommygug
06-27-2009, 06:28 PM
Nice fish...nicer pictures...I keep trying to get some decent pictures of mine but so far no luck...tomorrow I will try a white bucket and clean water!!!! It looks like your fish are coming along nicely...Yours look a like they are an inch or two already...mine only spawned 5/16...Now that the sun is out, I am beginning to see some "bling" of my own...I look forward to seeing some more pictures as they develop Good Luck

Hirogoi
06-27-2009, 10:03 PM
You have a nice little group of fish there.

Cindy_AL
06-27-2009, 10:39 PM
Thanks! :)

elduderino
06-27-2009, 11:54 PM
so much variance! very nice!

Midorigoi
06-28-2009, 03:00 AM
WOW! I really like many of those fry :yes:

Cindy_AL
07-11-2009, 01:10 PM
I released the 13 biggest babies into the pond today. Here are some pics of the ones I released....

rainblood
07-11-2009, 01:23 PM
They look like they have LF blood in them

Koijazz
07-11-2009, 02:10 PM
Very Nice Babies! Hope they're easy to find in your pond. How big are they?

Midorigoi
07-11-2009, 03:15 PM
All of those ogon fry are very vibrant and bright! Especially those two yellow ones...great looking fish.

Cindy_AL
07-11-2009, 03:32 PM
They look like they have LF blood in them


When I purchased the eggs, I was told the eggs were a mixture of regular & long fin. (the eggs came from several different parents) I prefer a variety so that was great with me. Of my 10 adult (?) koi, I only have one butterfly (a black one).
Im still looking for that one good koi that comes from each batch of eggs. Any idea if any have potential? I dont expect any show quality or a particular type... just one thats not considered a "mutt". :D:
(tho I would love to have a gray one like Stephen's or an ochiba) I have no idea how those would look at this age.

The ones I released today are about 2-2.5" in length. They seem quite happy to be out of the confines of the basket and are not afraid of the larger fish. There are plenty of hiding places so I know they will be fine. :yes:

jpeters407
07-11-2009, 10:22 PM
I think that your "blue" fish is a Soaragoi so you might get your wish to come true.

Cindy_AL
07-12-2009, 08:09 AM
I think that your "blue" fish is a Soaragoi so you might get your wish to come true.


I've had my eye on that one from the time they changed colors. So I will keep my fingers crossed. :yes: :clap:

rainblood
07-13-2009, 10:54 AM
Looks like you have some goldies too :confused:

Cindy_AL
07-18-2009, 06:27 PM
Its Saturday so that means its time for an update. I transferred 13 more babies to the big pond from the baskets. The other 13 have done great since moving them so I am anxious to get them all out of the baskets. Of the ones I released today, there is one really cool looking koi... it looks bright shiney green on its head and the scales down the lower half of its body then black on the upper half. Pretty cool looking... cant wait to see how it turns out.

I have several peach colored babies... wondering if they will remain that color.

Koijazz
07-20-2009, 11:40 AM
Very nice. I wish mine looked as nice as yours.

Cindy_AL
07-20-2009, 01:14 PM
Thanks!

Im still wondering about the green one... really strange color pattern. The green on the head & lower body is bright... sort of chartreuse colored. I havent seen him since he was released into the pond. There so many hiding places. I was worried about the 2 blue ones last week because I hadnt seen them. They showed up yesterday thankfully. They are kinda hard to see because they are so dark.

I wish there was a website of fry pictures to have an idea of what specific types of koi look like at different stages.

The first babies I released into the pond were very small & hadnt started developing any patterns yet. They were all yellow. I never knew if they survived or if they were hiding. Well, I have found one that I think is a koi. (I also had goldfish fry) It is about 2" long & hides in the rocks by the waterfall. I believe it is a koi because the goldfish have never been scared or hidden. They stayed together in schools. This one is all white with a red spot on its head like a tancho. Not sure if tanchos look like that at this age or not. Im hopeful tho.

Cindy_AL
07-21-2009, 11:58 AM
Is there any chance that my little green fish could be a Midorigoi?

Hirogoi
07-28-2009, 06:11 PM
Nope.

Cindy_AL
07-28-2009, 06:25 PM
Darn. :(

Midorigoi
07-28-2009, 09:42 PM
Looks like you've got bunches of ogon and chagoi! :clap:

Cindy_AL
07-29-2009, 06:55 AM
Now that the majority of the fry have been released into the pond, its hard to get good pictures of their progress. They spend alot of time under the waterfalls & hiding under the lily pads.

These are the ones I see on a regular basis during feeding time. They are really growing now that they can eat the smaller pellets.

The one that looked solid blue like a soragoi has changed over the past couple of wks. In the picture below of him, you can see a tiny light blue dot behind its head. Now it is a huge spot that looks to be spreading. Its an even color of light blue.

I have 2 that look ginrin... (the obvious one below & the fish beside it) The larger one is probably my favorite.

The white one is developing alittle more orange & looks doitsu. (I also have some solid peach ones that look doitsu)

The one that looks light blue multi colored is very social & gets right in the middle of the big koi during feeding... as does the black & yellow one below.

The other darker blue & black fish is really looking nice. The black spots have started blending together & the blue is remaining the same shade. I think this will be a pretty fish.

It is so fun watching them grow.

There is one fry that I released early on as an experiment to see if it could survive with the bigger koi & goldfish. It seemed to have some type of deformity with one side of its mouth. It was so small at the time. I really didnt expect it to survive & didnt have the heart to just dump it in the flower garden. It has survived and is growing as well if not better than the other fry. It is orange & white with shiney scales. This is him in the last 2 pictures. One if his good side & one of his bad. It hasnt affected his ability to eat.. just not sure if its something that will get worse or what. Thought I would just let nature run its course with him.

Koijazz
07-29-2009, 10:39 AM
They're so pretty! The deformed one has very nice fins too.

Cindy_AL
07-29-2009, 05:05 PM
I decided to try to get a few updated pictures today. Theres still alot more that stay in places that I cant get good focused pictures... such as under the waterfalls, etc.

I was able to get a couple of the blue one so you can see the lite blue spot that is spreading on its back. (I had to lighten those a bit so it looks alittle more white than light blue) I was also able to get alittle better view of the deformed ones mouth. Such as shame because I really like its body & color.

Hirogoi
07-29-2009, 05:15 PM
I like that little longfin.

Cindy_AL
07-29-2009, 05:20 PM
Thats the one with the deformed mouth. As long as he's not struggling to eat, Im keeping it.

Cindy_AL
08-15-2009, 05:51 PM
Today I released the last of my fry into the pond. Here are some pictures of those before I released them and a few of the babies already in the pond.

There is one photo of the black one with chartruese colored head & it appears to have white fins. It looks so cool in the water ... because of the dark body, all you see is its fins & glow-in-the-dark looking head. Its still fairly small so its hard to get a good focused picture of it.

Would like to find out if anyone knows whether the larger white one with the peach colored spot on its head will be tancho?

Also, there is a white one with a few black spots (the ones in the bucket) does anyone know if there is any chance it will remain black & white?

Thanks!
Cindy

Koijazz
08-15-2009, 08:02 PM
Very cute! Great job!

aryan8277
08-17-2009, 12:20 AM
Most of the fries i saw, has bloatted stomach. Is it normal for fries to have such a body formation? My opinion is maybe one or two looks ok.

Cindy_AL
08-17-2009, 06:30 AM
I have been feeding extra food trying to grow them as big as I can before winter. Most of the fish in my pond look alittle fat.

Cindy_AL
08-30-2009, 03:10 PM
Its really frustrating to get good pictures of the babies now that they are in the pond. I have a few that I havent been able to get in the pictures because they are either under the waterfalls or under the lily pads. Then you have the water reflections to deal with. I have one blue & black one that I can never get a good look at.
Anyway, looking back at the older pictures in this thread, I cant see a whole lot of difference other than size.
Also, the pretty little longfin has now turned all white. The questionable area on its mouth seems less prominent. (actually, I havent been able to see it at all)

The first picture comes with a question or 2.... Been watching this fish for awhile. It has always been one of the largest... was all peach colored until last week when it turned completely white. Any idea why? There is another which was identical in size & color but it is still all peach colored. (Im posting a pic of it too)

question #2: This one first caught my eye because it leans slightly to the right when it swims. It appears very healthy other than that. What could cause this?

Cindy_AL
08-30-2009, 03:15 PM
btw... the last picture shows the blue & black one that I can never get a good close look at. This was taken from across the pond.

Koijazz
08-30-2009, 06:00 PM
question #2: This one first caught my eye because it leans slightly to the right when it swims. It appears very healthy other than that. What could cause this?

I do believe the dorsal fin of a fish aids its balance. Nothing's wrong with the dorsal fin is there? I can't think of anything else.
(Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong about the dorsal fin)

Cindy_AL
08-30-2009, 06:12 PM
I do believe the dorsal fin of a fish aids its balance. Nothing's wrong with the dorsal fin is there? I can't think of anything else.
(Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong about the dorsal fin)

Dorsal fin seems perfectly fine to me. I cant come up with any logical reason why it "leans". Oh well.
They have started eating from my hand when the bigger fish eat. I get the pellets soggy first and they are doing really well. So far only the larger fry are brave enough to try it including this "leaning" fish & the peach/orange one that was identical. I noticed that the white one has really long barbels. Thats the only thing that looked even the slightest bit different than the others.

Koijazz
08-30-2009, 06:58 PM
By butterfly koi has long barbels too. I think it's just something they get a long with long fins.

Cindy_AL
08-30-2009, 07:05 PM
I think I will have several longfin koi.

Koijazz
08-31-2009, 09:36 PM
How big are those laundry basket things you used to put the fry in?

Cindy_AL
08-31-2009, 10:06 PM
I dont have the exact measurements. I would guess about 34-38" tall & about 14-16" in diameter. I used 2 of them.

EricT
08-31-2009, 10:19 PM
i have 5 i got for $1 each, that i am using to separate my koi next year :D:

be careful, they WILL rust.
-eric

Cindy_AL
08-31-2009, 10:26 PM
Mine are all mesh.. is that what you have?

I still have one of them laying down in the pond. The fish like to hide in it. I have also used it as a "trap" to catch some of my goldfish. I grab the handle & pull it to the surface real quick before they can swim out. It appears to be safer than a net & no chasing them around the pond.

mshill90
08-31-2009, 11:05 PM
I don't want to impose here, but where did you get your liner? I can not seem to find a place where they sell big enough liners, and I want to start my pond asap.

Cindy_AL
09-01-2009, 06:05 PM
I don't want to impose here, but where did you get your liner? I can not seem to find a place where they sell big enough liners, and I want to start my pond asap.

We purchased a 30 x 40 Firestone 45 mil liner from Webbsonline.com a few months ago for a total of $597. (includes freight charge) I spent hours comparison shopping and this was the cheapest place we found. We even looked at roofing rubber. You have to compare total prices to include shipping because thats where we seen a big difference. This liner was delivered from Maryland to Alabama within 4 days. We were extremely pleased with the transaction.

Cindy_AL
09-06-2009, 05:21 PM
I was trying to move some goldfish today & accidently caught the little black & blue fry that has been so elusive.

It appears to be longfin...its fins dont show up that well in the pictures. I know its head seems alittle small but it seems that alot of my longfin look that way. I like it though.
Just wondering if it will stay blue & black.

Koijazz
09-06-2009, 09:37 PM
It's so pretty! I'm thinking one of my fry look a little dark blue, but I'm afraid to take a picture because they always seem to change afterward!

Cindy_AL
09-06-2009, 10:16 PM
Thanks.
I know none of my fry will ever amount to more than pond mutts but boy do you get attached to them ... kinda like a mothers love, ya know. :yes:

I really like the color of this one. The blue seems so vibrant. Im sure it will change but its fun to imagine what they will look like when they are "done". :punk1: Actually, this one was released in the pond at the same time that the all blue (? soragoi wannabe) was released. (there are pictures of both together in this thread) The soragoi looking fry developed a couple of lite blue spots which I documented in this thread & they even got larger but now they are gone again. Who knows? Its wild the way even my larger koi are changing colors or patterns.

Im really surprised about how little info there is on the internet regarding koi fry patterns & colors for the different varieties. Seems like someone would document what each type would look like at each stage/age/size.

Cindy_AL
09-06-2009, 10:59 PM
heres a few pictures of the changes this koi has made since 6-27-09....

Koijazz
09-06-2009, 11:39 PM
Cool! Mine was a plain ol' dark one and one day I looked at it closely and wow!! That one looks kinda like the one on that forum! Sweet!

Cindy_AL
09-07-2009, 08:45 AM
Not sure if I mentioned it or not but that white one that leans alittle to the side is scale-less. Its skin is sorta like a catfish. Its sibling that remained peach colored is also scale-less.
I havent heard much about scale-less koi, have you? I have a couple that appear to be doitsu but I dont see any scales at all on top. :shrug:

Super Kindai
09-08-2009, 07:47 PM
the baby fish on #195 is most likely a Kumonryu of long fin version, isn't it?

There are two different types of Doitu koi. That type of the scale line up is called as Kagami goi = Mirror scale carp like a Shusui style which has scales on back bone line and sides of lateral lines. On the other hand, Kawa goi = leather carp have almost no scales on its body.

Cindy_AL
09-08-2009, 08:33 PM
the baby fish on #195 is most likely a Kumonryu of long fin version, isn't it?

There are two different types of Doitu koi. That type of the scale line up is called as Kagami goi = Mirror scale carp like a Shusui style which has scales on back bone line and sides of lateral lines. On the other hand, Kawa goi = leather carp have almost no scales on its body.

I must have my posts-per-page count set different than yours. Your post was #106 with my count. Which baby fish are you referring to?
I am grateful that you had time to take a look at my thread. I was hoping that you would but figured that you were busy.

I have just recently heard of mirror scaled koi. After doing alittle research, I am pretty sure that a couple of mine are mirror scale rather than ginrin. Actually, I didnt even want to mention those fry because I figured the wild looking scales just proved them less desireable.

I value your input.
Thanks! :)

Super Kindai
09-08-2009, 11:13 PM
Ahhh, I should have written as #103 because #195 was your total posts #.:eek1:

The first two koi of these pictures are leather carp type like a catfish and the last two fish are mirror scaled koi.

When scales of mirror scaled koi are ginrin, then it is a Ginrin Doitsu......:yes:

Cindy_AL
09-10-2009, 07:06 PM
Was taking some pictures of my larger koi and was able to capture a better picture of the little white butterfly koi that I had been telling you about... that was orange & white but recently turned all white. It was also the one that I was concerned about some type of deformity of its mouth. I can no longer see anything that looks abnormal with its mouth. (you can see previous pics of her at post #81 when she was still mostly orange)

This is such a pretty little fish... it just HAS to be a girl!! :D:

Cindy_AL
09-16-2009, 08:54 PM
Do you think the little butterfly will stay white now that she has lost all of the orange markings?

Tommygug
09-16-2009, 08:59 PM
Most times once a koi loses color with the exception of sumi it does not come back.

Cindy_AL
09-16-2009, 09:02 PM
I actually think she looks better all white & shiney. Would she be considered a platinum?

Tommygug
09-18-2009, 08:03 AM
I don't know what you would call it. I have a kohaku that lost its hi years ago, it looks similar to yours. A nice fish but it is not a platinum, maybe a Gin Rin Ogon, but that would be just a guess.

EricT
04-17-2010, 11:48 PM
:bump: any updated pictures?

-Eric

Cindy_AL
04-18-2010, 09:32 AM
So much has happened since I last posted in this thread. Lost several of my babies to what I believe was ick including the little white butterfly.
Most all have now been moved to the new big pond but we are dealing with green water at the moment. I have a some pictures taken a few wks ago. They are now about 5-6". Two of them went thru the bottom drain & ended up in the settlement tank. They were scratched up but doing fine. (I dont have recent pics of them tho...one was a black & orange & the other is the blue & black fish)

Thanks for asking. :)

dalozt
05-08-2013, 05:58 PM
Hey Cindy, I know this is a very old threads but I do love your posts.. Wondering how the babies are now.. And curious on the longfin doitsu matsukawabake (i think) the one that developed blueback and black coloration..

Cindy_AL
05-09-2013, 11:36 AM
WOW! This is a very old thread. I have raised 2 more sets of babies since then. Thanks for your interest. The koi you asked about has close to the same markings/coloration as before but has grown a lot.
I will attach some updated pics of these but they are from april & may, 2011. (some pics show that this koi when it had an injured scale on one side- it healed just fine) I probably have some more recent pics on my home computer & will check later. (these were just some that I had posted on my fb page)
I think you can see some of these babies in 2 short videos I also have on my fb page. (hopefully these links will work)

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10151540157089725&set=vb.767859724&type=3&theater

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10151540175559725&set=vb.767859724&type=3&theater

wayne1
05-10-2013, 02:55 AM
Hi Cindy thats a nice long fin Bekko and striped so carrys the scaled gene ! so good to mate with leathers and create more striped koi !looks a male fish with pearl scales !

dalozt
05-10-2013, 10:39 AM
Thats a nice long fin bekko and longfin benigoi u have the.. Both looks great.. What are the two batches that you bred?