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View Full Version : Huge diff in fry growth??



janine
02-21-2009, 01:21 PM
Was curious if anyone knows why the big diff in my fry growth? I have a 2 gal. on the kitchen container with about 13 in, and they are pretty good size, on the back porch I have my 20 gal, with 100 or so, and they are dinks. I was worried this morning, I went out and they were all hovering around the bottom, and their lil bellies looked empty. We had a cold snap last night, ck'd temp of water it was about 54 degrees. Do they stop eating on thier own when it gets cold?? I slowly warmed them up a little, over 60 now and the outside temp is warm too, so it should hold. Are they dinks because their is so many, or cause the ones inside have been warmer? Do they grow faster when it's warm? I should mention I have the 350 gal pond set up out there too with maybe 20 in there, they are dinks too. Another question, I have been feeding them frozen cyclops, I see a couple take it in, then spit it back out, do you think they are eating? I can't get the brine to hatch anymore??? Do eggs go bad? My microworms are on the way, do you think they'll be able to eat them? I also have brineshrimp flake food with powdery chunks of shrimp that I've been breaking up for them. I made a small bit of green water, how do you know if there is anything really in there?????:confused:

tyco4357
02-21-2009, 02:11 PM
My brine shrimp eggs hatch for about three days and then I clean out and start new. the powdered cyclopese might be better, can crumble it in your fingers to make it more powdery. As far as size, there are always different sizes, they grow at different speeds and yes warmer does help them to grow faster and more oxygen. The ones that get really big fast are considered Tobies. They are actually stronger fish but not as pretty and they will eat the smaller fry. Goi to pet store and get freeze dried daphnia and make into a powder. They also have baby brine shrimp frozen. Might be easter for you. The brine shrimp are only nutritious when they are in the baby stage. After that there really is no nutritional value. It's more like a treat. Get freeze dried blood worms and make into a powder, much more nutritous.

Davej
02-21-2009, 02:29 PM
Hiya Janine

Best temp is around 75 for growth, at temps below 68 it will be much slower. I haven't ever tried to raise fry at lower temps but suspect that things would be on a knife edge in the mid 50s..

The quicker they grow the sooner you can get them on sensible food!!:punk1:

If you get stuck then you can grind some hi protein pellets down to a dust and try that.

If the brine doesn't hatch then you may have a duff batch. :no: It should work like clockwork.

Over here we can get newly hatched brine in frozen blister packs that are always a good standby but are not cheap!!.

Bit of light reading for you; these were Maurice Cox's initial forays into breeding, from little acorns......... he is now the UK's No1 breeder!!:bow::bow:

http://www.koi-uk.co.uk/koi_breeding_index.htm

Keep at it!!

Best regards

Dave

vipldy
02-21-2009, 03:48 PM
You can try frozen baby brine from the pet store or fish store..When my fry were young they ate Hikari first bites which is a real fine powder. I got that at the local pet shop but dr. fosters and smith carries it to.. How big are they now?

Davej
02-21-2009, 04:15 PM
Hi Janine

Spot the Tobie, Hannibal the Cannibal !!

http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa98/davej111/2007_10260018.jpg

Regards

Dave

andrew davis
02-21-2009, 04:47 PM
That's a very pretty cannibal. I should hide the pretty l'il ones well away from that brute

Regards, andy
http://www.flickr.com/photos/21940871@N06/
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/adavisus/

janine
02-21-2009, 05:05 PM
Well my micro worms arrived and I've started my culture. Got another air pump, and am taking another try at the brine shrimp, we'll see tomorrow. I think it's the temperature helping growth inside. The ones in the house are about 3/4 inch, the ones outside are
< 1/2 inch. They are about 3 weeks now. Since warming the water, they seem to be doing much better. One inside is turning dark on top, and only one in the outside is turning dark, the rest remain clear yellowish. This is Florida, it's usually warm by now????

saltiery
02-22-2009, 01:17 PM
That's a very pretty cannibal. I should hide the pretty l'il ones well away from that brute

Regards, andy
http://www.flickr.com/photos/21940871@N06/
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/adavisus/

in case you missed this: he's a tobie...gets big by eating his siblings....remove him and any like him.

janine
02-23-2009, 10:20 AM
So far no Tobies, the ones inside are all growing at a faster rate. The ones outside, are all smaller, with the exception of two which are turning dark...I'll keep a watch, they may become Tobies! My microworm are growing, so The bigger ones are lovin them. We'll see how the lil ones outside grow now. The brine shrimp still haven't hatched, water, salt, and air, I'll give them a little longer but by tonight it'll be 48 hours. I am also giving them a turkey baster of green water, and the frozen cyclops, and freeze dried brine shrimp. I'm so concerned with their eating, I'm probably making my life much harder with the water changes almost everyday. Everyone is hangin in there so far though. I'll get pics!

janine
02-23-2009, 09:03 PM
Here is a picture of the ones in the 2.5 gal. tank, in the house.
I lost a few in the 20 gallon tank today:Drogar-Oops(LBG):...Ammonia spike. Help......I just changed the water yesterday 2/3, and today the Ammon was off the chart. I am feeding way too much I think. How do you know if it's enough????????? I changed it again today, I'll ck it again in the morning. I fed only brine shrimp today (got some to hatch) and no Cyclops. The little guys inside are growing fast, they are eating the micro worms. Notice spot...he's the one on the left.....cute huh? Ahhh, we like him! The rest are just clearish, or slightly orange.

CHICHI
02-23-2009, 09:08 PM
Here is a picture of the ones in the 2.5 gal. tank, in the house.
I lost a few in the 20 gallon tank today:Drogar-Oops(LBG):...Ammonia spike. Help......I just changed the water yesterday 2/3, and today the Ammon was off the chart. I am feeding way too much I think. How do you know if it's enough????????? I changed it again today, I'll ck it again in the morning. I fed only brine shrimp today (got some to hatch) and no Cyclops. The little guys inside are growing fast, they are eating the micro worms. Notice spot...he's the one on the left.....cute huh? Ahhh, we like him! The rest are just clearish, or slightly orange.

No Pic Janine :confused:

Bind with Amquel Plus or Zeolite as per Link suggested earlier :yes: Ammonia will Kill in short order :eek1: with Nitrite hot-on-it`s-heels :eek1:

janine
02-23-2009, 10:11 PM
It's there now!

Hirogoi
02-24-2009, 03:00 AM
You need more space to grow them in.

Midorigoi
02-24-2009, 05:02 PM
I would suggest moving many more fry into the 300 gallon, its what is best for them :yes:

Dave
02-26-2009, 03:41 AM
bigger is better for the grow out,

Or else filtration has to be really super duper, like a 20 gallon sump on that 20 gal. Go figure hey.

Best is in a bigger environment, and then green water.

janine
02-26-2009, 10:50 AM
I have a 500 gallon stock tank outside, but it is old and has rusted through on the bottom. If I got a swimming pool liner or rubber liner and set that up inside, clamping the sides sown, do you think that might work. At what point can I put a submersible filter/pump in and it won't suck up the babies? By the way.....these micro worms are working great, and the shrimp are hatching again:clap:. So other than the constant water attention, I mean you can't miss a day! I have probably a few hundred, I really haven't lost many of the initial hatch. I haven't found any in the big pond, so the Big fishies must have got all of the eggs, or them when they hatched. Keeping my eyes out though. I think I'll put the 20 galloners in the 350, and the 2 1/2 galloners in the 20 gallon and bring it inside. Maybe take a couple of the real small ones and put them in the 2 1/2. It's fish musical chairs....it is consuming my life!!!!! I"ll figure out a plan for the 500 gallon, my filter box is sitting in the big pond now getting seasoned. I'll keep ya posted!:eek1: