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View Full Version : Unexpected spawn, need guidence



janine
01-29-2009, 11:29 AM
Hi all, I'm new to this hobby of keeping koi, so new infact that My pond is still in the start up phase, not even stable yet. Came home yesterday to a pond full of eggs. I got some advise from another thread but thought I should jump over here. My plan is to set up my 20 gal tank, with an air stone and put the hyacinths in (eggs) I also have a 350 gal preform pond I can set up, that has a 600 GPH submersible in a filter box, with bioballs and such. It has a very small screen lid the water pulls through. Do I use the pond water? I mentioned it is not stable and is bound with chemicals (amquel). Should I start fresh? I mentioned on the other thread my above ground pool is sitting stagnant now for two mos, no chemeicals, lots of grren water, some one recommended using it for the larger 350 gallon pond, it would already have living food in it. Is this okay, cause WOW, that would be convient! I can get and hatch some brine shrimp, at what time ...days...weeks do I do things, is there a fry raising schedule somewhere? I need the basics really. Alot of the eggs are gettin eaten, so I'll be saving the ones on the hyacinths only. If I'm starting fresh, with well water naturally high PH, 8.0ish. do I add starter and that, or salt, or just the airstone. Should I bypass the 20 gallon and go straight to the small pond? Any info, would make me very very happy and greatful:bow: janine......in way over my head:eek1:

Midorigoi
01-29-2009, 01:10 PM
Use the green water, definately, your fry will have much more food and they will thank you for it :yes: Make sure you have a current running over the eggs, so dirt etc doesnt stick to them and suffocate them. I used an airstone :yes: with VERY VERY fine bubbles. I would start in the 20gallon, much easier to do water changes which you WILL need to do almost every other day. There is some great information in the breeders forum, look around a bit and you will find a ton of info that is very helpful.
Oh and steer clear of flake foods for the first few weeks, it can damage thier teeny little gills.

Hirogoi
01-30-2009, 12:52 AM
Put some eggs in your 20 gallon just for fun and in case something goes wrong with the rest. You can risk green water, but you never know what's in it. Personally I would just use some pond water. Do not use the 600GPH pump, too strong for the little ones. It'll mulch em. If you do decide to use it put some filter media pads over it so it reduces the suction. I'd repost on the main forum you'll get more info and help.

andrew davis
01-30-2009, 01:08 AM
Any body of water outdoors is likely to have dragonfly larvae in it. Should you rely on the outdoor pond to raise fish fry you may find over a month or two you have just a few very plump and happy dragonfly larvae

If you float a trash bag, filling it by pouring water through a fine mesh net, you might be able to create a safe floating isolation 'nursery'. Cover the top of the nursery with a fine mesh cover, so dragonfly can't lay eggs...

Check fry nursery after dark with a flashlight and scissors, to snip anything that looks like a dragonfly larvae...

oh, did I mention, dragonfly larvae probably represent the biggest risk to l'il bebby koi...

It's useful to set aside one fish fry nursery indoors, where you can pick out the most promising koi at the earliest stage, before they turn on each other... Often the prettier marked ones become prey to faster growing aggressive siblings

Regards, andy
http://www.flickr.com/photos/21940871@N06/
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/adavisus/

janine
01-30-2009, 07:48 AM
Thanks, the 750 pump is inside a filter box, bio balls fine sponge stuff and another spongy layer and a very fine fine sceen lid, is that enough to lesson the sucking power? The only opening is through the lid.

CHICHI
01-30-2009, 08:10 AM
Thanks, the 750 pump is inside a filter box, bio balls fine sponge stuff and another spongy layer and a very fine fine sceen lid, is that enough to lesson the sucking power? The only opening is through the lid.

As mentioned "Green Water" has all manner of Critters incorporated :eek1:

Two thirds of my Fry were killed by a plague of Tetrahymena :eek1:

Found on one of the deceased :eek1:

http://s215.photobucket.com/albums/cc183/mio022/?action=view&current=Smallertetra.flv

http://s215.photobucket.com/albums/cc183/mio022/?action=view&current=Paramore.flv

Hirogoi
01-30-2009, 01:18 PM
Well, you can hope. Just make sure you hit it with a lot of ammonia binder and continuously. Those guys produce a lotta waste and the chemical spikes get as little nuts. This might sound weird, but I have friends who just stick some eggs in the filter box of the main pond on purpose, it usually produces nine or ten good sized babies in six months or so. No need to feed or mess with em, they just do their own thing.

tyco4357
01-30-2009, 09:16 PM
When your fry hatch you will understand why you can't use a lot of areation or suction. You just have to wait till they hatch.

Hirogoi
01-30-2009, 11:04 PM
Honestly if you're not prepared for it it's gonna be really hard to do the right stuff now. Just experiment. Throw some in each setup you have. Keep some in the filter box of the main pond, and just go with it.

tyco4357
02-02-2009, 11:42 PM
OK, have any eggs hatched yet?

janine
02-19-2009, 10:28 AM
Well so far the lil frys are hangin in there. I have the 20 gal. the small prefab pond and a small 2 gal tank in the kitchen with a couple. I was hatching Brine in the beginning, but for some reason they have stopped hatching for me. I'm feeding frozen cyclops now and powdered brines hrimp. and I have a micro worm culture on the way. The kitchen guys are the largest, probably the most benefit from the brine shrimp. Allot more survived than I originally thought. The 20 gal. is swarming. I'm keeping my levels stable. Any reason why my bottle of Brine would all of a sudden stop hatching?? The koi all look yellow at this point, they were clear, but getting more yellow, is that normal before changing or are all all them gonna be yellow? Mama is the one in the picture (avatar) she is a butterfly. If age matters in Males, then the likely candidates are only a yellow and white, or a blue and white/orange Doitsu (maybe?) Or a solid orange. There was one butterfly that looks just like her that was tailing her alot, but he's pretty small? The rest are pretty young. Of course I have no idea who are males. I know they are mutts, I'm just looking forward to mutt varieties, how long till they color up. It's been 2 weeks, they are about 1/4 to 1/2 inch, are they progressing normal? They seem to be constantly pooping, thats a good sign right?????? Means they are getting enough? How can you tell if they are eating enough?:rolleyes:

Davej
02-19-2009, 11:33 AM
Hi Janine

I normally use a plastic drink bottle with the bottom cut off to hatch my brine.

salted water in the bottle with an air feed through a drinking straw right down to the bottom of the bottle so it agitates them, its not the air they need but to be kept suspended in the water.

Need to be kept warm for quick hatching, at 28C they will hatch in 24 hours. They also need plenty of light ,I rig something up over the top.

Couple of photos may help, probably a bit on the big scale for your needs but you could scale things down.

So difficult judging how much to feed, main thing is to work real hard on keeping the water sweet, Ammonia is your biggest enemy and in a small tank can occur quickly, if you can rig up some sort of a feed in and overflow to waste of dechlorinated water it will help keep on top of things. Dont forget though to put a bit of stocking over the overflow though to stop the fry getting swept out!!

Stick with it:yes::yes: The end results are worth all the effort!

Regards

Dave

http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa98/davej111/2007_09290015.jpg

http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa98/davej111/2007_09290016.jpg

janine
02-19-2009, 11:55 AM
They were hatching well the first few times, like clockwork. Now, notta, maybe I'm not keeping them suspended enough, I'll increase agitation. Thanks!