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seaward
12-05-2007, 09:02 PM
Hi,
I'm a new member and first time user. Has any one heard or seen Ghost Koi's?
The local Water Garden Center sells Israel Ghost Koi. hb

Dillon
12-05-2007, 09:23 PM
I googled an article containing a picture.

http://www.cascadekoi.com/Koi/IsraeliGhostKoi.aspx

MrHusband
12-05-2007, 10:02 PM
More often than not, lawn and garden centers on Long Island market "ghost koi" that are brown or black fish that have a colored head. The "ghost" is that against a black liner, the fish is invisible until the head is apparent. See, you have a "ghost" of a fish swimming in the pond until the it comes straight at you to feed. Basically a failed Matsuba, you can see the underlining color after the fish grows and developes a little fukurin.

Simi Koi
12-06-2007, 12:42 AM
the koi in the photo looks like a doitsu aka matsuba to me :confused:

Shorty
12-06-2007, 01:27 AM
I have seen tons of ghost koi. I have a good picture of one, it is on the top of this page:
http://www.shortypen.com/koi/koi/index2.htm
See Koi 20, the black and orange big one in the photo.

I heard that a large percentage of a spawn will be ghost - that is light colored head and fins, with a dark black or olive body. I saw that in a pond rescue, pulled in hundreds of baby koi in the 1" to 3" size, and about 25% were ghost colored, the rest were olive. I think the birds ate all the colorful ones, the water was only about 1 foot deep when I got there.

Another good picture is Koi 5, and Koi 11 on this page:
http://www.shortypen.com/koi/koi/index.htm

They are neat to have - look like a skeleton swimming in your pond. Sort of the same enjoyment of having an all black koi that suddenly appears, and then dissapears.

Simi Koi
12-06-2007, 02:55 AM
Koi 11 and 20 are just a matsubas that turned very dark. I have seen it happen several times.

I suspect the whole "Ghost" koi thing is a way for some breeders to pawn off their culls at a higher price.

Lori Jo
12-06-2007, 04:05 AM
Koi 11 and 20 are just a matsubas that turned very dark. I have seen it happen several times.

I suspect the whole "Ghost" koi thing is a way for some breeders to pawn off their culls at a higher price.

It's all about marketing. Personally I like to see who is eating all that expensive food.:yes:

Dillon
12-06-2007, 01:36 PM
LOL I cannot argue w/ ya!


It's all about marketing. Personally I like to see who is eating all that expensive food.:yes:

seaward
12-06-2007, 10:36 PM
Thanks for the responses! I may purchase one of those ghosties next summer.:cool:

Dave
12-07-2007, 02:01 AM
here is a pic of a doitsu ghost that was on auction a while back.It is 16cm (6inch) it was bred by Aoki.

Cowiche Ponder
12-07-2007, 01:10 PM
reading the article that was posted towards the top none of the other fish pictured match what the "ghost" koi from Israel seems to be. Which looking at the picture does look like a doitsu matsuba, but is lacking the intensity of color even in the black. Doesn't do much for me

IMSALSMOM
12-07-2007, 11:43 PM
I have a Koi that looks just like #20, it was solid black when I got it.

Rudy
12-07-2007, 11:57 PM
reading the article that was posted towards the top none of the other fish pictured match what the "ghost" koi from Israel seems to be. Which looking at the picture does look like a doitsu matsuba, but is lacking the intensity of color even in the black. Doesn't do much for me

Like this old armor koi /may be leather :confused:
I always thought to be close to Ghost koi. Must now look for Ghosts.

Cowiche Ponder
12-08-2007, 12:07 AM
Rudy that looks closer to what it seems they are looking for in a "ghost" koi in Israel

Dave
12-08-2007, 02:57 AM
Like this old armor koi /may be leather :confused:
I always thought to be close to Ghost koi. Must now look for Ghosts.


Rudy based on most places i've looked and what i have read, i would say what you have there are Ki Shusui???

Just my opinion. They have all the Features of a shusui, but are yellow.

They look very nice anyway, adds a colour dimension to the pond.

the pond must be viewed as a pallette of colour, with all the fish making a balanced harmonious picture of moving and living colour, shape, size, and varieties. The Ogons forming your base colour, the shusui's etc adding the next level of depth, the darker types adding contrast and finally the gosanke adding quality and beauty.

My opinion anyway

Dave
12-08-2007, 03:04 AM
Koi 11 and 20 are just a matsubas that turned very dark. I have seen it happen several times.

I suspect the whole "Ghost" koi thing is a way for some breeders to pawn off their culls at a higher price.

yup will agree with you there. also can't see the pic in 5 clearly, could be any one of the goi's including speckeldy.;) ;) ;)

Lots of pets shops and others market and sell koi (deplorable grade, no where near commercial grade even) with out having a clue about what they are actually selling.

Koi farms all over the world breed and export koi that to the purists mind should have been culled. Thats why japanes fish are so in demand, they have maintained their standards and sell fish they would be proud of.

These so called fish farms sell anything that swims whether it conforms or not.

Rudy
12-09-2007, 01:12 PM
Rudy based on most places I've looked and what i have read, i would say what you have there are Ki Shusui???

Just my opinion. They have all the Features of a shusui, but are yellow.

They look very nice anyway, adds a colour dimension to the pond.

the pond must be viewed as a pallette of colour, with all the fish making a balanced harmonious picture of moving and living colour, shape, size, and varieties. The Ogons forming your base colour, the shusui's etc adding the next level of depth, the darker types adding contrast and finally the gosanke adding quality and beauty.

My opinion anyway

Thanks for the input :yes:

That beautiful specimen above :rolleyes: would be Stanley our first koi for a whopping $5.00 :D:
He changes color all the time. In that picture his yellow was starting to come in again but there are other times the top will fade to that bone color you still see a little of on the face.
When he shows that color he literally looks like a fish skeleton moving in the water.

IMSALSMOM
12-09-2007, 09:22 PM
Rudy, I Think Stanley Is A Darling Fish, Just Friday I Bought A Small Longfin That Looks A Lot Like Him. He Was Solid Metalic Gold With The Black Doitsu scales And Shortly After I Put Him In My Pond He "turned" A Beige/gray. I Still Love Him, But Am Looking Forward To Seeing What He Does Next.

Rudy
12-09-2007, 09:28 PM
Rudy, I Think Stanley Is A Darling Fish, Just Friday I Bought A Small Longfin That Looks A Lot Like Him. He Was Solid Metalic Gold With The Black Doitsuscales And Shortly After I Put Him In My Pond He "turned" A Beige/gray. I Still Love Him, But Am Looking Forward To Seeing What He Does Next.

I can never get rid of him. See the cross shaped emblem on his head? :eek1:
That thing I call Stanley has gone through the ringer so many times over and to this day has no visible marks of damage.
It would be bad Juju to let him/her go.

Hope yours is a happy camper. :yes:

IMSALSMOM
12-09-2007, 11:11 PM
Hope yours is a happy camper. :yes:

He's running with the Big Dogs, doesn't seem to know he's less than 1/2 the size of the next smallest fish.

Wishing you good juju in this Holiday Season.

Dale Ann

Dave
12-11-2007, 11:42 AM
guys,

This ghost koi thing is pretty confusing to say the least. Was at a Koi farm on Sunday and the two chaps that run the place couldnt agree on what it was. This seems to be one of thoser nobody really knows what to say or call it , and ZNA hasn't said anything.

So i guess its a all go area.

i dunno. Lets see what comes out with some more research.

Which ever way , rudy , your fish are still very impressive.

By the way they had one at the farm on Sunday but it was already sold.

Also i apologise to everyone else for not taking pics, my batteries on my digital are flat and i cannot find my charger.

Simi Koi
12-12-2007, 01:35 PM
guys,

This ghost koi thing is pretty confusing to say the least. Was at a Koi farm on Sunday and the two chaps that run the place couldnt agree on what it was. This seems to be one of thoser nobody really knows what to say or call it , and ZNA hasn't said anything.



The ZNA will not be saying anything. The "Ghost" koi is not a recognized variety and I doubt it ever will be. It is a marketing gimmick invented by some unknown breeder or dealer to sell off his Matsuba culls that turned black.