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View Full Version : Domestic Koi- Your Opinions



Shannon66
11-18-2007, 09:01 PM
Hello Everyone,

What is the general opinion on domestic koi? I have 2 and the never seem to get anything really wrong with them. My other imports seem to have more problems at times.

I like domestic because they seem to be healthier to me. On the other hand, imports look better to me. What does everyone think?

Who is a good breeder who has good looking domestic koi?

Thanks!

Shannon :confused:

richtoybox
11-18-2007, 09:28 PM
There are really nice domestic koi and really ugly imported koi. Depends mostly on price and source. I have several domestic from Brady at Lotus Land Koi Farm that are excellent. One took best in size at Southern Koi Expo. There are a few others that have high quality domestic koi.

All spawns have less than desirable koi, some of which are sold cheap to keep the space to grow the better ones. Some breeders are not interested in culling for quality and just interested in selling small.

Headache
11-18-2007, 09:51 PM
Three years ago , I wouldn't have had a koi unless it was from Japan , I was wrong . There are several Domestic Breeders that are doing a great job developing great koi .

This young lady was born right here in the USA (Quality Koi Farm) . This past spring she won Baby Grand Champion at a show , beating out 32 other koi (Mostly from Japan) .

vipldy
11-18-2007, 09:54 PM
I have a few and they seem hardier if you ask me:yes: Great colors and very good growth..Thumbs up for our domestic breeder's:clap:

Marie

PapaBear
11-19-2007, 07:16 AM
There are a handful of Domestic breeders who are doing exceptional work, and we have the good fortune to have several who are members here. The "Big 4" IMHO would be (in alphabetical order) Brady, Brett, Matt, and Richard. They all have been producing Koi I honestly admire for quite a few years.
There are definitely others who do good work, but I'm just not personally familiar with their fish to be able to comment on them.
One advantage domestics SHOULD have if they are well bred and kept is hardiness. Koi that have lived their entire lives in a certain climate with a particular type of water will become naturally acclimated to those conditions, while fish from entirely different conditions on the other side of the world may suffer setbacks due to changes.
When you couple that with the fact that most of the ordinary Koi imported from Japan are their lower quality culls, it is only natural that they won't be the greatest.

Andrew Hoag
11-19-2007, 10:36 PM
PapaBear,

I know of Brady and Richard. Who would Brett and Matt be ?

Regards,
Andrew

Headache
11-19-2007, 10:43 PM
Brett owns a koi farm in Texas . Matt runs Quality Koi Farm in New Jersey .

moikoi
11-21-2007, 12:52 AM
i heard hobbyist say....in smaller size domestic has a good chance of beating those japanese fish,but in the heavyweight division "no chance" :no:

steveamy
11-21-2007, 10:24 AM
i heard hobbyist say....in smaller size domestic has a good chance of beating those japanese fish,but in the heavyweight division "no chance" :no:

Yet;)!

PapaBear
11-21-2007, 03:26 PM
Yet;)!

Ditto that:D:

Rick Gippner
11-21-2007, 03:29 PM
Ditto, ditto, that:D:

moikoi
11-23-2007, 12:39 PM
only if the Japanese stop breeding for the next 10 yrs. they got too much advantage over everybody else.

Just Jessie
11-23-2007, 12:50 PM
I have several fish from Richard (SJKoi), their growth rate has been phenonminal!!!! Fish born this spring already pushing 12- 13 inches :yes:. At least I think that is good, I don't have the experience of others, but it seemde fast to me considering our limited "growing season" here up North

Bill OTMS
11-23-2007, 02:16 PM
My favorite expression is that in Japan, their koi are domestic. Here are my beauties from Brady (pictures taken on arrival):

Cowiche Ponder
11-23-2007, 02:17 PM
YES!!! sigh..I want more Bradygoi...

vipldy
11-23-2007, 02:18 PM
My favorite expression is that in Japan, their koi are domestic. Here are my beauties from Brady (pictures taken on arrival):

Beautiful fish:bow:

Marie

raganwald
11-23-2007, 04:47 PM
What beautiful Bradygoi! Much nicer than mine in many respects.

Just so I know whether to pester Santa with requests... What price range should I budget when I'm ready for something like the second Koi (the larger pic) from a "domestic" breeder like Brady???

moikoi
11-23-2007, 05:19 PM
What beautiful Bradygoi! Much nicer than mine in many respects.

Just so I know whether to pester Santa with requests... What price range should I budget when I'm ready for something like the second Koi (the larger pic) from a "domestic" breeder like Brady???

check his website. he had a beautiful 2 yr old female sanke for $1200

Bill OTMS
11-23-2007, 06:08 PM
check his website. he had a beautiful 2 yr old female sanke for $1200

moikoi has it close enough. Brady's fish are of the highest quality so the prices range (tosai-nisai) $200-$1200 as you would expect from any excellent breeder.

Koidaddy
11-23-2007, 07:02 PM
Three years ago , I wouldn't have had a koi unless it was from Japan , I was wrong . There are several Domestic Breeders that are doing a great job developing great koi .
This young lady was born right here in the USA (Quality Koi Farm) . This past spring she won Baby Grand Champion at a show , beating out 32 other koi (Mostly from Japan) .


Yup, I agree! Nice home grown koi to be had right here on our doorstep! What I especially like about the American farms is that you are able to develop a relationship easily with the breeder, fore instance, I often e-mail Brady at Lotus Land Koi Farm and get direct feedback from him personally... now that's a connection I'd have difficulty with in Japan!:yes:

KD
BTW, nice Kohaku :cool:

premster
11-25-2007, 12:30 AM
I think it matters not if the koi are domestic or from japan , the things that matters are
1.0 Genetics - good to great parent stock
2.0 skill of the breeder to select the correct fish to grow out.

PapaBear
11-25-2007, 11:46 AM
I think it matters not if the koi are domestic or from japan , the things that matters are
1.0 Genetics - good to great parent stock
2.0 skill of the breeder to select the correct fish to grow out.

Thazzit right there. We are fortunate to have several who have truly been developing that skill right here at home:bow: , and the best is yet to come:clap:

Shannon66
11-26-2007, 11:51 AM
Thanks for your input, everyone. I appreciate it!

Shannon Langeberg

Koifan!
11-26-2007, 05:15 PM
I read recently in one of the koi magazines a quote (maybe from Matt at Quality Koi) that a 'high class koi is a high class koi regardless of where it was bred' and I think that makes a lot of sense. Their ancestors were all Magoi once upon a time, there were no gin-rin showas in the rice paddy reservoirs a hundred years ago. As far as hardiness is concerned, any healthy animal, fish, or bird is going to adapt to its environment and if the environment is too perfect (Hiroshima?) and if the subject has been 'babied' (overly dependent on salt for instance) it will not have had the opportunity to adapt to the stresses that it may encounter in a harsher environment. I think that's why I've only ever had problems with my imported fish and I've never had a single problem with any of my domestic fish (Which I got from Nisei Koi in NJ through Lee Menzsak of the Koi Farm, in NY; thanks Lee!)

Sumthinfishys
11-26-2007, 08:03 PM
http://www.fototime.com/D9026B329D612FD/conv.wmv

Mike C

Sumthinfishys
11-26-2007, 08:05 PM
http://www.fototime.com/93E72032AC682DD/conv.wmv

Mike C

Sumthinfishys
11-26-2007, 08:06 PM
http://www.fototime.com/CFB904B1C5682E3/conv.wmv

Mike C

Sumthinfishys
11-26-2007, 08:07 PM
Seems these Koi could do very well in the show curcit.

Mike C

Bill OTMS
11-27-2007, 08:56 AM
Mike - Very nice fishies - who's da breeder?

Sumthinfishys
11-27-2007, 05:22 PM
Mike - Very nice fishies - who's da breeder?

Brady Brandwood of Lotus land Koi farm.

Mike C

Bill OTMS
11-27-2007, 07:30 PM
Of course!!!

Sumthinfishys
11-27-2007, 08:03 PM
Of course!!!

I have to admit, I was surprized. Ive seen allot of Bradys Koi look real good. But that good with those bodies! Wow, Im impressed. Id have some new Koi If I had the $$$.

Mike C

gonecadd
12-04-2007, 09:06 AM
i heard hobbyist say....in smaller size domestic has a good chance of beating those japanese fish,but in the heavyweight division "no chance" :no:

Seems I read somewhere about a large koi competing and winning over some of the Japan Koi.

IMO koi bred in the USA can be just as good as the imports.

moikoi
12-06-2007, 01:31 AM
Seems I read somewhere about a large koi competing and winning over some of the Japan Koi.

IMO koi bred in the USA can be just as good as the imports.

if that was true we would be exporting to Japan.

Bill OTMS
12-06-2007, 02:46 PM
if that was true we would be exporting to Japan.

Let's wait and watch:punk1:

moikoi
12-06-2007, 06:36 PM
Let's wait and watch:punk1:

we can wait until the cows come home. ;)

Fishbreeder
12-07-2007, 08:49 AM
if that was true we would be exporting to Japan.

Years ago I exported many koi to Japan and SE Asia. Nowadays it is illegal to import koi into Japan, so you cannot export koi there.

BTW, When have ANY Asian markets allowed fair trade with us (US)???????????

Brett

Headache
12-07-2007, 09:09 AM
BTW, When have ANY Asian markets allowed fair trade with us (US)???????????

Brett

Don't get me started !!! I'd TAX the crap out of every car they bring in the US .

Fishbreeder
12-10-2007, 10:42 AM
Hahaha, gotta laugh or cry....

Try and buy a GMC pickup in Japan. Cost maybe $100K.

Unfortunately, I ain't gonna buy no GMC, Ford, or Dodge pickups. Been there done that, got the receipts from the shop, the car rental place, the taxi service, and sore feet.

I've broken some Toyota pickups, but, I've never had to walk home and leave the yotabanger behind. I've had GMC, Chevy, Ford, Dodge and even AMC/Jeep pickups, and EVERY one of them has left me afoot at one time or another.

Now, saying that I still do not agree with the trade status we have with Asian countries. It just ain't fair.

My Tacoma was made in Indiana. Tundras are made in Texas, but, somehow they still have the Japanese quality built in. "Made in Japan." It used to mean cheap and easily broken. Now it means absolute quality. If I treated a Ford like I do my rice burner, I'd be afoot in 10,000 miles. I get about 150,000 before a trip to the shop, and that is usually for a clutch. Big tank full of koi in the back on a regular basis, that and a lot of four wheeling in the mud and sand, hard on the clutch.

My family's first Toyota was a 1963 Corona (we lived in Japan). My mother drove it. My dad drove a Hino-Contessa (French sports car). Mom's car always ran, Dad's was always in the shop.

Brett

mike pfeffer
12-10-2007, 04:24 PM
I just sold my Toyota Tundra and went to a domestic, a Chevy, for the first time. You're making me nervous Brett.

Brady Brandwood
12-10-2007, 05:59 PM
My farm van is a Dodge product - 180,000+ miles of good rollin' before it was retired to the farm. The timing belt exploded at 140,000 - a couple of hundred yards from an auto repair shop (the van did what it could to help), then it started leaking oil at the crank seal and leaking water from the water pump at 180,000. Now it just runs up and down the hill at the farm carrying Koi food, supplies, and culls,... and it does a great job at that!

Best Wishes,
Brady

Fishbreeder
12-11-2007, 12:08 AM
I had one of those old Dodge vans. Come to think of it, it was better'n any of my (American made) pickups. We used it for a long time on the farm, called it our "four wheeler" as it did have four wheels. We even put the fish tank inside it and used it to harvest.

Alas, it finally died and could not be revived, sombody carried it away, probably to the masher.

Its been years and years since I had an American truck. I've got several friends that have put a lot of hard miles on several different, large, American pickups. My buddy that pulls a huge fish trailer couldn;t get by without his huge pickup. I'm glad I don;t have to pay for his fuel.

Brett

smithvillemike
01-03-2008, 02:55 PM
There are a handful of Domestic breeders who are doing exceptional work, and we have the good fortune to have several who are members here. The "Big 4" IMHO would be (in alphabetical order) Brady, Brett, Matt, and Richard.

I would agree with your statement. Of course the fact that I own koi from 3 of the 4 breeders mentioned wouldn't have anything to do with it.

Mike

Sumthinfishys
01-03-2008, 06:52 PM
Don't forget Purdin Koi farm. They are producing some truely awesome Koi.
www.koiforsale.com

Mike C

Cowiche Ponder
01-03-2008, 10:35 PM
My farm van is a Dodge product - 180,000+ miles of good rollin' before it was retired to the farm. The timing belt exploded at 140,000 - a couple of hundred yards from an auto repair shop (the van did what it could to help), then it started leaking oil at the crank seal and leaking water from the water pump at 180,000. Now it just runs up and down the hill at the farm carrying Koi food, supplies, and culls,... and it does a great job at that!

Best Wishes,
Brady

Have a 93 dogde p/up..cummins diesel engine.. 285,000+ miles (especially the + as sometimes the odometer doesn't work!!) and it runs great!! Now the truck itself is falling apart around the engine....

Cowiche Ponder
01-03-2008, 10:48 PM
My farm van is a Dodge product - 180,000+ miles of good rollin' before it was retired to the farm. The timing belt exploded at 140,000 - a couple of hundred yards from an auto repair shop (the van did what it could to help), then it started leaking oil at the crank seal and leaking water from the water pump at 180,000. Now it just runs up and down the hill at the farm carrying Koi food, supplies, and culls,... and it does a great job at that!

Best Wishes,
Brady

Have a 93 dogde p/up..cummins diesel engine.. 285,000+ miles (especially the + as sometimes the odometer doesn't work!!) and it runs great!! Now the truck itself is falling apart around the engine....

Shannon66
01-12-2008, 08:02 PM
:11-20: How in the world did my post turn into domestic autos instead of domestic koi? :11-20:

Shannon

vipldy
01-12-2008, 08:04 PM
Page 4:yes: Brett started it:D:

Marie

BillJ
01-13-2008, 02:05 AM
Just how many pickups do you have,Mary?:rolleyes:

Bill

BillJ
01-13-2008, 02:07 AM
Aren't koi like most other animals...less hardy as the breed is refined? The Japanese have been at it much longer.

Bill