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imperialkoi
04-11-2017, 06:50 PM
Hi,
I am looking for a pre filter solution. my problem is that i have
- suspended particles looks like algae and debris flying in my pond water
- its creating bubbles as well
- My koi are shiroji are like red.
- Hydro Sieve is collecting lots of algae like fine stuff which I have to to rinse it 2 times a day! I am very tired of washing it but my koi's body is still red and bubble in my pond.

I have 6,000 gallon pond. here is my configuration:

4'BD=>Hydro Sieve Pre-filter 300 micron==Artesian Pump 1/8 HP 3,900 GPH==57Watt UV ====Nexus 300 (wash 2 times a week)==back to pond

4'BD=>Hydro Sieve Pre-filter 300 micron==Artesian Pump 1/8 HP 3,900 GPH ====Ultima 6,000====57Watt UV===back to pond

Skimmer with 57Watt UV inside====Artesian Pump 1/8 HP 3,900 GPH===Ultima 6,000===================back to pond

Please advice recommendation with pre filter solution or others. Thank you

trumpetdoug
04-11-2017, 07:09 PM
The obvious here is you need to go down to 100 micron or less. This would probably mean a RDF or something similar. I have the exact same issue for years now with suspended solids. I'm seriously considering a RDF.

Doug - out

Josh H
04-11-2017, 08:50 PM
Another option if you don't want to go the rdf route would be to upgrade your pumps that are running the ultima 6000's... they are rated for a 6000 gallons an hour pump at 10' head... I would try that first and see if it helps with your suspended solids and it should help to clean out the ultima's better when you flush them. If you got the advantage 8500's "they changed the name now" but they would probably flow close to what your looking for... How is your fish load and how much are you feeding as this also plays a part as well... Me personally, I would get rid of the hydro sieve's, they are very maintenance heavy and are not really a sieve more of a glorified leaf basket. I would let the Nexus and ultima's handle all of the debris and maybe increase the amount of flushes of those based on how your water looks "i.e shines" or based on the feed rate... best of luck, keep us posted...

MCAsan
04-11-2017, 09:48 PM
Good mechanical stages:
RDF is probably the best but the most expensive
Parabolic sieves like UltraSieve III, ZakiSieve, or Cetus are likely second best
Static beds might be next...only because they are easy to clean
Brushes, matting, foam (you don't want to even try to clean foam).

imperialkoi
04-11-2017, 10:32 PM
Another option if you don't want to go the rdf route would be to upgrade your pumps that are running the ultima 6000's... they are rated for a 6000 gallons an hour pump at 10' head... I would try that first and see if it helps with your suspended solids and it should help to clean out the ultima's better when you flush them. If you got the advantage 8500's "they changed the name now" but they would probably flow close to what your looking for... How is your fish load and how much are you feeding as this also plays a part as well... Me personally, I would get rid of the hydro sieve's, they are very maintenance heavy and are not really a sieve more of a glorified leaf basket. I would let the Nexus and ultima's handle all of the debris and maybe increase the amount of flushes of those based on how your water looks "i.e shines" or based on the feed rate... best of luck, keep us posted...

I have about 20 koi from ranging from 6inches, 18, 20, 22, 24, 26, 2 koi at 29 inches. They are so hungry I tried to feed them 2 times a day but like very little. I would love to feed them more seeing their desires for food. I back wash like every 2 days. It bothers me much now that my pond has bubbles. I am think it's spinning all the debris back into the water. My koi body are like red so I am very nervous to even feed them.

- Nexus has tiny green algae when back wash.
- 6000 gal ultima filter doesn't have a blower so it wasted lots of water when I backwash. They glass show suspended green particle but the water comes out of the backwash is clear.

I have tried to take the Hydro Sieve out like so many times but they pond got worse so I ended up having to put it back in service right away after 1 day. - - As for pre filter, RDF...it good i heard lots of good things about it. but it's cost too much and plus I am nervous about moving parts. It will need maintenance when it breaks down.
- Sieve box would be too much work to dig a pit and put it under ground etc.
- I am looking at Zakkisieve since it can operates above water level. I am waiting for a call back to get more information. I wonder if anyone has experience with this up to date. I see reviews from old old posts not sure it's up to date. I got info like it can filter down to 250 micro and I wonder if this can really fix my problem.

coolwon
04-11-2017, 11:42 PM
New UV tube. Tubes have short life span 6 to 9 months

Check pump selection for your Nexus model.

Need more water turning over

Blocked impeller or pump intake maybe

Check biological filtration, pink shiroji. High ammonia /nitrite?

Suspension not a problem.

Get the health aspect sorted out first.

Garfield

vipertom1970
04-11-2017, 11:50 PM
Do you want clear water like this without UV and almost ZERO maintenance then RDF is your best friend. Year number 4 running with the only problem was a blown fuse but I bypassed for two days and got running again. If you spend $$$ for a sieves + bead filter then it's almost a same price as RDF.


pond is 6' deep.

tbullard
04-11-2017, 11:59 PM
Since you have a Nexus 300 the simplest solution is the DracoDrum http://www.dracodrum.com/

Here is my thread documenting the install http://www.koiphen.com/forums/showthread.php?156383-Nexus-RDF-Upgrade-with-DracoDrum

coolwon
04-12-2017, 12:16 AM
Do you want clear water like this without UV or almost ZERO maintenance then RDF is your best friend. Year number 4 running with the only problem was a blown fuse but I bypassed for two days and got running again. If you spend $$$ for a sieves + bead filter then it's almost a same price as RDF.

Very neat!

With Gin water and a large selection of Gosanke, has Hikui/Hikkui ever been evident?

Garfield

vipertom1970
04-12-2017, 01:09 AM
Very neat!

With Gin water and a large selection of Gosanke, has Hikui/Hikkui ever been evident?

Garfield

No but I do get shimi on kohaku.

imperialkoi
04-29-2017, 12:07 AM
Wow, you water quality is excellent and your koi collection is awesome as well. Drum seems like a good idea. filter of the future.

I have been looking at the ProfiDrum Eco 55/40 RDF Filter. I wonder if that is the size for my 6,000 gallons pond. The 45/40 seems too exact without room to upgrade for faster water cycle laters. I have 2 BDs and 1 skimmer with 3 pumps doing (3,700 gph).

I wonder if anyone selling unused or used profit drum? the brand new one cost $4,830. My water is ok now but too much manual cleaning. I am very interested in the drum solution to automate the cleaning part.

Stevectx
05-08-2017, 02:12 AM
Do you want clear water like this without UV and almost ZERO maintenance then RDF is your best friend. Year number 4 running with the only problem was a blown fuse but I bypassed for two days and got running again. If you spend $$$ for a sieves + bead filter then it's almost a same price as RDF.

vipertom, What RDF are you using? I'd like to employ one but I have only one 2" water line from the bottom of the pond unfortunately and not sure I could use a profidrum with that small of a water supply line.

Koi Acres
05-08-2017, 07:32 AM
Wow, you water quality is excellent and your koi collection is awesome as well. Drum seems like a good idea. filter of the future.

I have been looking at the ProfiDrum Eco 55/40 RDF Filter. I wonder if that is the size for my 6,000 gallons pond. The 45/40 seems too exact without room to upgrade for faster water cycle laters. I have 2 BDs and 1 skimmer with 3 pumps doing (3,700 gph).

I wonder if anyone selling unused or used profit drum? the brand new one cost $4,830. My water is ok now but too much manual cleaning. I am very interested in the drum solution to automate the cleaning part.

The Profi drums typically do not come up for sale used, if you are looking for a new one dealers are listed on this website:

http://www.profidrumusa.com/

Koi Acres
05-08-2017, 07:35 AM
vipertom, What RDF are you using? I'd like to employ one but I have only one 2" water line from the bottom of the pond unfortunately and not sure I could use a profidrum with that small of a water supply line.

The Profi drum can also be pump-fed and gravity returned to the pond - I am not sure what you have for filtration after the pump so gravity return may not work if you have a pressurized system.

Paultergeist
05-08-2017, 12:18 PM
Do you want clear water like this without UV and almost ZERO maintenance then RDF is your best friend. Year number 4 running with the only problem was a blown fuse but I bypassed for two days and got running again. If you spend $$$ for a sieves + bead filter then it's almost a same price as RDF.

Tom, Do I understand correctly that you have no UV at all? -- just RDF to a shower?

kimini
05-08-2017, 12:33 PM
Do you want clear water like this without UV and almost ZERO maintenance then RDF is your best friend. Year number 4 running with the only problem was a blown fuse but I bypassed for two days and got running again. If you spend $$$ for a sieves + bead filter then it's almost a same price as RDF.
I think other issues are contributing to the clear water because free-floating algae is so small that it passes right through an RDF screen.

Not picking on you in particular but many pond owners tout their clear water to single reasons, while the real answer is much more involved, like: a small fish load, don't feed much, a deep pond, the time of year, amount of shade, whether UV is being used, etc., etc., etc.

vipertom1970
05-08-2017, 01:37 PM
Tom, Do I understand correctly that you have no UV at all? -- just RDF to a shower?

Paul, I do have UV in the system but do not turn them on at all, have not replaced the bulbs for over 3 years. Circuit 1. RDF to shower 9,000 GPH, circuit 2. RDF to up flow water fall(5,000 GPH).......moving 14,000 GPH with 700 watts.

vipertom1970
05-08-2017, 01:43 PM
I think other issues are contributing to the clear water because free-floating algae is so small that it passes right through an RDF screen.

Not picking on you in particular but many pond owners tout their clear water to single reasons, while the real answer is much more involved, like: a small fish load, don't feed much, a deep pond, the time of year, amount of shade, whether UV is being used, etc., etc., etc.

yes, anything smaller then 70 microns is still in the water column, I don't have shades over my pond, I feed 12 times per day in the summer, 16 large fish. I personally think UV is bad for ponds because it's just masking a problem.

Jonathan1982
05-15-2017, 05:49 PM
Paul, I do have UV in the system but do not turn them on at all, have not replaced the bulbs for over 3 years. Circuit 1. RDF to shower 9,000 GPH, circuit 2. RDF to up flow water fall(5,000 GPH).......moving 14,000 GPH with 700 watts.

That is really nice setup. I would like some insight into that.

vipertom1970
05-16-2017, 09:11 AM
That is really nice setup. I would like some insight into that.
Here goes

Huysy
05-16-2017, 09:30 AM
Very nice Tom. How long have you had your carbon filter?

vipertom1970
05-16-2017, 10:56 AM
Very nice Tom. How long have you had your carbon filter?

I think it's year number 4 and I should be recouping my money starting this year for not spending $300 per year on Chloram-X.

Note: This Centaur carbon is only to remove chloramines from city water.

friscoponder
05-16-2017, 11:26 AM
Tom: Your controllers look different. Did you replace one of them?

vipertom1970
05-16-2017, 01:46 PM
Yes, I had an electrical power surge that blew the fuse and varistor in one of the controllers. I bypassed the drum for two days by taking out the bypass SS plates inside the drum and Mike got me the new controller within two days. New controller came pre-wired.

Mpayne
05-17-2017, 09:22 AM
I have a roughly 6k gallon pond in full sun here in North Texas. I am not running any sieve but I do run two converted pool cartridge filters in series as my first stage mechanical filter. In the spring I use fine green mat in the first one, then a sandwich of 100u (micron) outside/50u inside. right after the spring clean-up until I'm running good and clear for a week then go to the green mat in both and unless we get bad weather and trash blow in. then I will repeat as needed. Now I am a bit of an old timer and I Do PP treatments every couple months. This works well for me. If you are not accustom to using PP treatment research first. If miss used you can do major damage to your fish and or Bio-Mass.

bdel01
05-31-2017, 12:29 PM
Yes, I had an electrical power surge that blew the fuse and varistor in one of the controllers. I bypassed the drum for two days by taking out the bypass SS plates inside the drum and Mike got me the new controller within two days. New controller came pre-wired.

how easy is it to remove, then re-install the plates?

vipertom1970
05-31-2017, 01:49 PM
it takes less then 2 minutes, just a 4" dia SS plate with couple SS bolts and if you can unscrew a light bulb then you can do it. the RDF would be acting almost like a sediment filter when you take out a plate.

imperialkoi
06-17-2017, 11:32 PM
Hello Tom and everyone,
I got a profidrum installed yesterday 55/40.

2 (BottommDrain 4in) and 1 (skimmer 2in) ===>RDF

1st pump 3,900GPH /57 watts uv/ then go to my nexus with moving K1
2nd pump 5,200GPH just return to the pond with waterfalls
skimmer has 57 watts UV installed

1. it's been 24 hours now since the RDF has been running but I still see lots of tiny particles in my water still. My question is that when or how long does it take for the RDF to remove all my flying particle problem. I can't wait for my koi to feel better with good water.

2. since my skimmer is only 2inches gravity feed so it's pulling kinda slow. My question is that do you guys know any good solution to remedy this problem.

Thank you all

Huysy
06-17-2017, 11:54 PM
You are always going to have some floating particles in your pond even with an rdf. The koi munching on the algae on the bottom and walls constantly release tiny particles into the water. Give the rdf more time. Your water will be very clear soon.

Your 2 inch line from your skimmer is definitely losing out to your 2 bottom drains. I am in the same situation as you, and my skimmer is encased in concrete and rebar. How easy is it to replace your skimmer? If you can, here is a thread about
converting a waterways skimmer to a 3" or 4" connection for gravity flow.

http://www.koiphen.com/forums/showthread.php?35797-Larger-Pool-skimmer-gravity-flow

vipertom1970
06-18-2017, 01:02 AM
In order to have particles be removed out of the water column they have to be captured through the RDF. If you have the air dome on then turn it off for couple hrs.to let the floating particles settle to the BDs.

1. Please check the seal between the dirty water side and clean water side to make sure there is no gap.
2. Make sure the spray nozzles spay evenly like a fan pattern on each nozzle( very easy to have small particles stuck inside the nozzles on the initial startup for new RDF.
3. How many minutes between each cycle ?
4. Use a black sharpie and mark the drum then cycle it to see if it rotates at least 370* for each cycle.
5. Show me the height of the sensors and drum water level after each cycle.


After switching from Cetus to PF, it took couple days to clear it and it used to cycle every 10 minutes for three days but now is like every 40 minutes.

imperialkoi
06-18-2017, 10:42 PM
In order to have particles be removed out of the water column they have to be captured through the RDF. If you have the air dome on then turn it off for couple hrs.to let the floating particles settle to the BDs.

1. Please check the seal between the dirty water side and clean water side to make sure there is no gap.
2. Make sure the spray nozzles spay evenly like a fan pattern on each nozzle( very easy to have small particles stuck inside the nozzles on the initial startup for new RDF.
3. How many minutes between each cycle ?
4. Use a black sharpie and mark the drum then cycle it to see if it rotates at least 370* for each cycle.
5. Show me the height of the sensors and drum water level after each cycle.


After switching from Cetus to PF, it took couple days to clear it and it used to cycle every 10 minutes for three days but now is like every 40 minutes.

1. checked the silicon ring and it's all good.
2. spray nozzles is good. At the beginning I had that sand stuck in there but after take it out and clean it 3 times. it's all good now.
3. roughly 30min each cleaning cycle.
4. didn't do a 360 degree. it's like 300 degree to me. I left everything default setting from factory. How can I adjust it to do the 370 degree?
5. she probes and water level is at the metal bracket where the probes are about 2 inches down.
6. I put a small pump in the pond skimmer and return it to the waterfall. do you know if it's ok to do so? so the small pump go back to the pond and the 2' inch gravity fed to the RDF.
7. The control box. it's installed under my deck. I wonder if it's ok to leave it there? is it waterproof? I saw you leave your out in the open from you pond pic.

Thank much again for your help and advice.

vipertom1970
06-18-2017, 11:43 PM
Everything looks good, control box under the deck is good(I have a plastic box over it to protect from the sun)but change the rotation to to about 380* or a nitch over the original point of rotation. To change the time for the rotation, take the 4 screws out from the font of the box then use a small screwdriver to turn the dial then test it again. 30 minutes between each cycles is not bad, your pond should be pretty clean at that frequency. Can you temporary diver the pump from the skimmer to pump it into the dirty side of the RDF or do 1 S&G filter and return it to WF.

imperialkoi
06-18-2017, 11:55 PM
Thank you so much! I will observe the new Profidrum and hope it will bring good filtration for my koi.

BWG
06-19-2017, 07:56 AM
For those that don't want to pay for a RDF there is also the low cost fines filter that has been proven by thousands. A sand and gravel filter.

vipertom1970
06-19-2017, 10:11 AM
For those that don't want to pay for a RDF there is also the low cost fines filter that has been proven by thousands. A sand and gravel filter.

I think the OP got tired of cleaning his filter couple times per day that why he went with RDF. You trap, you clean !

houstonderk
06-19-2017, 10:36 AM
Everything looks good, control box under the deck is good(I have a plastic box over it to protect from the sun)but change the rotation to to about 380* or a nitch over the original point of rotation. To change the time for the rotation, take the 4 screws out from the font of the box then use a small screwdriver to turn the dial then test it again. 30 minutes between each cycles is not bad, your pond should be pretty clean at that frequency. Can you temporary diver the pump from the skimmer to pump it into the dirty side of the RDF or do 1 S&G filter and return it to WF.

Interesting, I had turned mine to only rotate maybe like a quarter to half at most to see if it saved water but seemed to run more. Changed today to turn that much so will see how different the water usage is.

vipertom1970
06-19-2017, 11:09 AM
Water usage should be the same assuming the drum rotates 360* every hour or if the drum rotates 1/4 turn 4 times per hour. You don't want junk to stay in the water column longer and the motor works 4 times more which will worn out faster.

I hope I explain it correctly.

kimini
06-19-2017, 12:22 PM
In order to have particles be removed out of the water column they have to be captured through the RDF. If you have the air dome on then turn it off for couple hrs.to let the floating particles settle to the BDs.

1. Please check the seal between the dirty water side and clean water side to make sure there is no gap.
2. Make sure the spray nozzles spay evenly like a fan pattern on each nozzle( very easy to have small particles stuck inside the nozzles on the initial startup for new RDF.
3. How many minutes between each cycle ?
4. Use a black sharpie and mark the drum then cycle it to see if it rotates at least 370* for each cycle.
5. Show me the height of the sensors and drum water level after each cycle.

...
It only needs to turn enough to clean the portion of the screen that's submerged, which is typically about 180 degrees. The caveat to this is the rare case where the dirty screen stays exposed to the air long enough to dry out, which is unlikely if it has a lid on it.

vipertom1970
06-19-2017, 12:43 PM
180* seems low, it's depending how much water is feeding the RDF, the drawdown inside the RDF and sensor level but the bottom line is to only clean the submergered screen area. This is based on my pond with two PF drum RDFs running in it 4th year but I guess you have to play with dial on the controller.

houstonderk
06-19-2017, 01:44 PM
Water usage should be the same assuming the drum rotates 360* every hour or if the drum rotates 1/4 turn 4 times per hour. You don't want junk to stay in the water column longer and the motor works 4 times more which will worn out faster.

I hope I explain it correctly.

Okay, that makes sense. Timed it with the 360 rotation and get a cycle at 10 mins. Turned off the BD air to see if I can flush out those small floaters. Had used PP at the beginning of the year and seems it has been holding floating debris more so far than usual.

vipertom1970
06-19-2017, 01:57 PM
Okay, that makes sense. Timed it with the 360 rotation and get a cycle at 10 mins. Turned off the BD air to see if I can flush out those small floaters. Had used PP at the beginning of the year and seems it has been holding floating debris more so far than usual.

adjusting the sensors will also affect the cycling frequency.

velvetbone
06-19-2017, 03:36 PM
adjusting the sensors will also affect the cycling frequency.

Tom,
Can/could you see any benefit to having the sensors higher so they the RDF cycles more frequently? I'd swear I'm using less than a 1/2 gallon of water as of now. Gonna find time to repeatedly measure the amount it uses.
Vince

vipertom1970
06-19-2017, 03:59 PM
Tom,
Can/could you see any benefit to having the sensors higher so they the RDF cycles more frequently? I'd swear I'm using less than a 1/2 gallon of water as of now. Gonna find time to repeatedly measure the amount it uses.
Vince

I like setting the water level on the clean water side at the same height as the SS bracket where the two sensors sit on regardless how fast or slow the pump is running. If you reduce the pump RPM then move the sensors up and if you increase the RPM then lower the sensors. Try that then see how long it takes between each cycle, I try to keep it around 30 minutes.

This is all based on my experience with my pond but remember all ponds are different.

velvetbone
06-19-2017, 05:40 PM
I like setting the water level on the clean water side at the same height as the SS bracket where the two sensors sit on regardless how fast or slow the pump is running. If you reduce the pump RPM then move the sensors up and if you increase the RPM then lower the sensors. Try that then see how long it takes between each cycle, I try to keep it around 30 minutes.

This is all based on my experience with my pond but remember all ponds are different.

Hi,Tom,
Sorry.... not to hijack the thread.....
That's exactly what we did when you came and visited a few weeks back. And I still am following your advice!!:bow3:
However, the time between my cycles are a lot longer than 30 minutes. They're on average 50 minutes. Sometimes longer. Not feeding much since we are still cycling. Had an issue with "pea soup". The new UV has been online for 6 days and things are now a greenish fog hue.
V

vipertom1970
06-19-2017, 06:55 PM
Hi,Tom,
Sorry.... not to hijack the thread.....
That's exactly what we did when you came and visited a few weeks back. And I still am following your advice!!:bow3:
However, the time between my cycles are a lot longer than 30 minutes. They're on average 50 minutes. Sometimes longer. Not feeding much since we are still cycling. Had an issue with "pea soup". The new UV has been online for 6 days and things are now a greenish fog hue.
V

green water is due to pond not yet cycling and patience is the name of the game in this hobby. Your pond cycles every 50 minutes because it is way too clean, it has nothing to do with green water.

1. Do you see fish waste in the waste tray ? keep feeding your herd.
2. is ammonia and nitrite both ZERO and what is the reading for nitrates ?
3. are the media still really white or brown color and did you add more media ?

velvetbone
06-19-2017, 07:19 PM
1. Yes.... I see debris being washed away
2.Ammo = 1.0-1.5
NitrIte = 0.0
NitrAte = 0.0
KH = 10 drops
Ph = 8.4 ( I know on the high side but it is steady and consistent)
Salt = 0.05 (that's just what comes out of the tap here in Poway)
3.Media is turning tan. I'm up to 6.2 cubic ft

I'm currently using Chloramx to bind and have salt for the NitrItes

I've slowed the return water through the weir to increase the "dwell time" of the water in the UV. The UV can handle a flow of 8000 gal/hr. I'm way under that figure. I'm only running 1750 RPMs at 375 watts on our FF.
Thanks for your help
V

imperialkoi
06-19-2017, 07:48 PM
Hello Tom,
It's been 4 days my water is still having fine particles in it and my water is not crystal clear like before. The slow skimmer, does this affect the the filteration process? The water surface is not clear and has some bubbles. Thanks.

Should I put in a strong pump into the skimmer?
Should I do 30% water change to help the RDF? The RDF has been removing lots of debris I see it in the bucket

vipertom1970
06-19-2017, 10:29 PM
Bubbles telling me you have DOC so water change is your best solution. Can you switch the two pumps and use the bigger pump on the Nexus(what is the max flow on the Nexus). Where is the skimmer pump to ?

You might have to shut down the RDF if you take out 30% water or by pass to keep bacteria alive.

I do get a lot of floating particles too that don't really make it to the BDs or skimmers.

imperialkoi
06-19-2017, 10:56 PM
Bubbles telling me you have DOC so water change is your best solution. Can you switch the two pumps and use the bigger pump on the Nexus(what is the max flow on the Nexus). Where is the skimmer pump to ?

You might have to shut down the RDF if you take out 30% water or by pass to keep bacteria alive.

I do get a lot of floating particles too that don't really make it to the BDs or skimmers.

Nexus is not all that great with flow. it's only handle 3,200 GPH. My strong pump is 5,200GPH. It will fill to the top of the nexus. if anything clog it will overflow. I had an overflow the other day. It was thinking the strong pump can cycle water via the nexus for maximum biological filtration but doesn't work out well. I have to switch to the smaller pump 3,900GPH. It's artesian so it's an easy swap if I need to.

I wonder if slow intake from the skimmer can be a problem. since it doesn't skim the dirty surface so it becomes suspended and DOC. Before the installation of the RDF. My water was shiny but the only problem I have was so much particle which I feel my filter didn't filter.

I will do that 30% water change. oh also my moving k1 in the nexus was brown and nice. 2 weeks ago I found it all white and clean. I wonder what happened. Did I have a PH crash that killed all the good bacteria or what?

thanks.

vipertom1970
06-19-2017, 11:08 PM
Be patience, if the the RDF cycles every 10 minutes from the beginning and now cycle every 20 minutes then it's doing it job. Did you shut down the Nexus for a long period of time ? Is the Nexus your only bio ?

imperialkoi
06-19-2017, 11:51 PM
I never turn of the air for my nexus. it was boiling fast at all time. I was happy the k1's were brown but now they are like white and new. Yes nexus is my only bio now since I dont want to keep bead filter and have to clean it. I want to go low maintenance.

vipertom1970
06-20-2017, 12:30 AM
Best is to test the water with a test kit. my theory why the K1 is now white is because the RDF is too effective by removing waste out of the water colum so less ammonia which is a food source for bacteria. Bacteria will only adjust with how much ammonia is in the water column.

koiman1950
06-20-2017, 04:28 PM
Tom

I don't really think that any RDF will remove ammonia from the water column, as it's a in a liquid state. I would think quite possible the K1 is not as brown is because the water is actually mechanically cleaner overall. I agree though, the Nexus has an issue due to available flow rates as they are too low.

vipertom1970
06-20-2017, 04:37 PM
Tom

I don't really think that any RDF will remove ammonia from the water column, as it's a in a liquid state. I would think quite possible the K1 is not as brown is because the water is actually mechanically cleaner overall. I agree though, the Nexus has an issue due to available flow rates as they are too low.

Sorry, maybe I did not explain it clearly, I assume solid waste sitting in a pond would produce ammonia so removing it early out of the water column would cut the amount of ammonia in the pond.

TylerDurden
06-20-2017, 08:52 PM
A stronger skimmer suction may help you with bubbles and surface debri. My skimmer will suck up all my bubbles that I get from spawns or when treating the water. I do have to adjust my weir door according to water heighth, so its not as open to create better surface suction.

icu2
06-20-2017, 09:47 PM
A stronger skimmer suction may help you with bubbles and surface debri. My skimmer will suck up all my bubbles that I get from spawns or when treating the water. I do have to adjust my weir door according to water heighth, so its not as open to create better surface suction.

How do you adjust the weir height?

TylerDurden
06-20-2017, 10:14 PM
Mine is very "jankie" lol. My weir is connected at the bottom of the opening so when it is flowing it swings in and swings out when no flow is coming in. I basically drilled a small hole in the skimmer above the weir and connected a large zip tie to it. I then rest my weir on the zip tie when the pump is running. There are much better ways to go about it im sure but that's how I did it. I basically have a lip on my weir that catches the zip tie and if the pond level gets to low the weir usually falls off the zip tie, but if the pond gets to high the weir floats and also comes off the zip tie.

I didn't want anything permanent due to water levels varying throughout the year

Pond,James_Pond
06-21-2017, 10:17 AM
How do you adjust the weir height?

I use a section of pipe insulation. It slips over the top edge of the weir and adds flotation, so the weir stays higher and skims a thinner layer of the surface.

t'other steve

imperialkoi
06-21-2017, 01:49 PM
FYI- Tom and every 5th day after the RDF install, my water is clear and looks like 90% of suspended particles are gone. Very happy now. I feel good spending the money on the RDF now. It's worth it. I wonder if I have enough biological since I am running 3,900 GPh from The RDF to my big 300 nexus with moving K1. I am truly happy and thank you for your recommendations of the RDF solution.

koiman1950
06-21-2017, 02:25 PM
I thought your pond was around 6000gal?!? Do you have a second circuit for additional flow that I've forgotten about? The color of the K1 would most likely have something to do with how much is being fed/fish density overall.

vipertom1970
06-21-2017, 02:47 PM
FYI- Tom and every 5th day after the RDF install, my water is clear and looks like 90% of suspended particles are gone. Very happy now. I feel good spending the money on the RDF now. It's worth it. I wonder if I have enough biological since I am running 3,900 GPh from The RDF to my big 300 nexus with moving K1. I am truly happy and thank you for your recommendations of the RDF solution.

6,000 gallon pond , you need to flow at least 6,000 GPH through the bio and don't just run clean water back to the pond without running through a bio filter first. I don't know your pond design but adding a shower will help a lot with bio or if you want that extra polishing then do one S&G filter from the skimmer circuit but that requires little maintenance. Two circuits with bio is the way to go.

always make sure you have constant water coming into the pond(drip in or autofill) to offset the water going out or else you will have problem.

imperialkoi
06-21-2017, 03:28 PM
6,000 gallons pond

2 Bd and 1 skimmer into the RDF

Output 1: 3,900 GPH to 55 watts UV to 320 nexus with moving k1
Output 2, 5,200 GPH just to the waterfall back to the pond
Skimmer has 55 watt UV

vipertom1970
06-21-2017, 03:35 PM
You do not have enough bio. How high is the WF above the pond water level ?

koiman1950
06-21-2017, 03:43 PM
Are those the flow rates of the pumps at a certain head? If so, you won't actually be flowing that much water. And, sorry, those skimmer UV units are more trouble than they're worth. glad the RDF is doing the job but your system, like Tom says, is biologically way underfiltered. You couldd actually get rid of the Nexus and add a Zakki shower unit at the top of the waterfall and do much better. It would also reduce the restricted flow in the system due to the Nexus speed limits. And I'm sure your RDF would work even better with a much higher flow rate.

imperialkoi
06-28-2017, 08:19 PM
569876569875

Hello Tom and eVeryone, I have both circuits going to k1 moving bed now before going back to the pond now. The water has been good for the last 5 days. There is a little bubbles at the moment. I can see the koi generate bubbles while they're at the water surface eating. As far as particles it's pretty much gone. Big thumbs up to the RDF for removing good fine stuff. I have been feeding the koi 3 times a day but small meal. The water seems ok with the rate of feeding. I want to know if I need a shower. I heard it's good but honestly I don't want it since I have to cut my waterfall to accommodate the shower. I don't like to expose the shower since it doesn't make my waterfall and pond look good. so at the end do I need it? Can I get by with both k1 moving bed and regular water changes? please let me know. Thanks.

vipertom1970
06-28-2017, 09:11 PM
You can have the WF dump into the shower and enclose the shower with stone. Is the water fall loud ?

imperialkoi
06-28-2017, 09:19 PM
do i need a shower? with only k1 moving beds, is it enough filtration to start a expensive koi collection without killing them? shower seems more work which i have to cut all that stone out. I don't want maintenance of a shower as well. the falls it's pretty loud but not much. bearable to stand around to enjoy koi.

TylerDurden
06-28-2017, 09:23 PM
Maintenance with a shower???? If you have an RDF feeding a shower you have basically no maintenance.

vipertom1970
06-28-2017, 10:47 PM
Don't need a shower yet unless k1 could not handle the bio load. You can set a shower on top of the blue barrel so the water from the shower goes into the blue moving bed assuming the blue barrel is gravity back to the pond.

Zac Penn
06-29-2017, 09:20 AM
do i need a shower? with only k1 moving beds, is it enough filtration to start a expensive koi collection without killing them? shower seems more work which i have to cut all that stone out. I don't want maintenance of a shower as well. the falls it's pretty loud but not much. bearable to stand around to enjoy koi.

You will have to wait and see what happens with your water quality.
The blue barrel has brand new K1 in it so it really isn't doing anything just yet. You have to wait for it to change color. That indicates that bacteria has colonized the media.
The K1 that is in the Nexus doesn't look very dark, so it isn't working very hard. Either it is not getting enough water from the pond to satisfy a large bacteria colony, or the pond water just doesn't have enough ammonia/nitrite to feed a large colony.

So if your water quality tests are currently good (unreadable ammonia/nitrite when using the drop test kits) then there is no need to add more biological filtration.

HOWEVER, if you notice that the carpet algae on the pond walls and floors starts to grow and turns into long strings, and at the same time the water quality tests remain good....Then you do need more biological filtration on the pond. If the water tests say the pond is good but the algae is growing then the algae is converting the nitrogen before it can make it to the biological filters.


If I remember correctly from our previous e-mails you have about 24"-30" of elevation difference from the pond water to the earth where the bottom drain pipes come out of the pond. If you can dig down so that the bottom of the filter area could be 48" below the water level, you can install a Gravity Fed Zakki Shower (G-Shower) after the ProfiDrum, and before the water pump. This way you can get the benefit of the G-Shower, without having to do any construction work on the actual pond. This seems like a pretty simple upgrade actually. Just dig out a small space, pour a small concrete pad (or install large pavers over compacted earth) and gravity feed a shower filter, so you can send completely filtered water back to the pond under the pressure of the water pump. This way you could feed your waterfalls after the G-Shower.

Here is a link to the G-Shower...
http://www.koiphen.com/forums/showthread.php?159256-Deepwater-Koi-s-Gravity-Fed-Zakki-Shower

imperialkoi
07-02-2017, 10:33 PM
Hi tom, zac and everyone.
I have added another 2 inch pipe to gravity feed to the RDF from the skimmer. So my 2 BDs and skimmer all have 4 in connection to the RDF. I had this skimmer yellowish/green foam before the RDF install. After the installation, the foam was gone and my skimmer was clear. Now that foam is back. I wonder what is it and the cause. Please shed some lights on this if you guys have experience this before. Thanks a bunch. I am still adjusting my pond configuration still.

as for as shower, I am still waiting to see if I need more bio. My plan is to get my contractor to break out some concrete from the waterfalls and put in a shower next year.


570034

tbullard
07-02-2017, 11:49 PM
Hi tom, zac and everyone.
I have added another 2 inch pipe to gravity feed to the RDF from the skimmer. So my 2 BDs and skimmer all have 4 in connection to the RDF. I had this skimmer yellowish/green foam before the RDF install. After the installation, the foam was gone and my skimmer was clear. Now that foam is back. I wonder what is it and the cause. Please shed some lights on this if you guys have experience this before. Thanks a bunch. I am still adjusting my pond configuration still.

as for as shower, I am still waiting to see if I need more bio. My plan is to get my contractor to break out some concrete from the waterfalls and put in a shower next year.



2 - 2in lines don't equal 1 - 4in line.