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View Full Version : Any last minute pointers on Mud pond constuction do's and don'ts?



fishin4cars
11-04-2013, 10:36 AM
I have been thinking about adding another larger mud pond in the back for some time, Last week I ran upon a super deal in trade for someone to come dig it out for me. He came by Friday and we set stakes out. 80' x 35'. May be slightly larger when done, waiting and seeing on the exact size as we go along. The bull dozer and Trac hoe came in this morning and we are now breaking ground. I have been at the mud pond harvest this past weekend and haven't had time to do any other posting in preparation so I'm posting on the fly. Does anyone have any input that might be beneficial to know? LOL Kind of late to be asking now but it won't be completed today I'm sure. Plan is 4' deep at the back end between 5-6' at the deep end. I want the sides straight down along the edges, He suggests sloped in sides. This would be something I would like to get input on. I'm planning on putting in my own drain system so the water can be lowered as I see fit. The small pond was an experiment to see how the ground would hold water and if there was problems under ground that I wasn't aware of. It worked great this past year and even with little rainfall and 32" deep it held water very good for a new dig. I'm expecting about the same here, Same location and soil, good clay, very little erosion. I don't have a lot of experience with seining so this is one of my biggest concerns. I'll be in and out but if anyone has any suggestions, Please, I'm all ears.

fishin4cars
11-04-2013, 10:58 AM
Pictures speak a thousand words. So welcome to our ground breaking.

Koigrl
11-04-2013, 04:19 PM
:yo:
yes, could be too late!
nice big pond you have and full of water. ;)
I can speak to the straight/slope sides issue. I too want my sides straight down to foil the bird, but it's not considered safe. standing on the edges, they can give way. if you're in the pond, you may not be able to get out.
there's a formula for this, a ratio of how deep and what kind of grade.
do some diligence with other mudponders, but i can tell you, my bulldozer man only reluctantly gave me a steeper wall than he was comfortable with and in the end, clay caved off the slope and filled in the bottom. ;)

This is going to be some fun!
:wave:

richtoybox
11-04-2013, 08:07 PM
You can build it with straight sides but the koi won't let it stay that way very long. They mine the soil looking for various bugs, crayfish, snails, and other delectable delights, and the walls end up filling the bottom. Ray Abell had two mud ponds made somewhat close to each other and they came awfully close to becoming one pond. He ended up lining the walls with large rock to keep the koi from excavating the sides.

BWG
11-05-2013, 01:15 AM
I have built a lot of them. The pond walls will eventually cave in if straight. Make them a minimum of 45 deg (1:1 ratio). Most pros go 2:1 ratio , 2 feet run to 1 foot rise is even better. I use rebar and 2 strands of heavy fish line as an inexpensive fence to keep herons out. Weld on some cast iron finials (or use epoxy or construction adhesive) and they look very nice. Better off putting gravel on the banks to start with. Even without koi straight banks will fall in eventually.

fishin4cars
11-06-2013, 12:44 AM
Well, chalk this up to another lesson learned. Should have started asking questions before the man started digging. I told him I wanted it sloped and the sides straight down along the edges for the first three feet then taper down. The wife had to go to the hospital this morning and when I got back he had already been long at work. I didn't end up with quite what I wanted. But on a good note, He moved most of the dirt to the low grounds and leveled up a lot of land in the bottoms for free. He said he would see what he could do about the sides but doesn't know if he will be able to do much about it now.

Koigrl
11-06-2013, 09:07 AM
Well, chalk this up to another lesson learned. Should have started asking questions before the man started digging. I told him I wanted it sloped and the sides straight down along the edges for the first three feet then taper down. The wife had to go to the hospital this morning and when I got back he had already been long at work. I didn't end up with quite what I wanted. But on a good note, He moved most of the dirt to the low grounds and leveled up a lot of land in the bottoms for free. He said he would see what he could do about the sides but doesn't know if he will be able to do much about it now.


All is not lost! your pond holds water! if you want to see how bad a dig can go see my thread, "the 300,000 gallon mud pond challenge.' http://www.koiphen.com/forums/showthread.php?104263-the-300-000-gal.-mud-pond-challenge.

Also, when the koi start chawing at the bank, don't worry, they can't go far!
Congrats on your new plaything. The fun is about to begin. :yahoo:

BWG
11-06-2013, 10:07 AM
At your depths if you have any bank problems in the future you can clean them up by renting a small backhoe or trackhoe. The seasoned professional that built my very first pond many years ago told me "Mother Nature in time will always determine the final slope" and how correct this statement turned out to be. Looks like a couple of good ponds to raise some fish in. I have also built ponds this size and depth using nothing more than a tractor the size in one of your photos. I used a TSC 6 foot landscape box with teeth, 3pt dirt scoop and FEL on the tractor.

vpkoi
11-07-2013, 12:45 PM
pretty cool to have your own mud pond.

fishin4cars
11-07-2013, 09:06 PM
I worked yesterday on spreading dirt before the rain came in, Tried to get the back in the goats enclosure area smoothed out and the rye grass planted so the rain would water it in. Was able to plant 50# of rye grass seed, and had enough time to make a few passes in the bottom of the pond with the tractor to smooth out the bottom and clean up the side some before it started raining. I did get to bevel the bottom some but not nearly as much as I wanted. Woke up this morning with about a foot of water in the bottom, so guess I'll have to deal with what it is for this year. I should be able to get some pics this weekend for another update but had to work today and tomorrow all day.

Billy Pounds
11-07-2013, 09:54 PM
UUUUHHHHHHHHHHHHHH....how close is this to your "SINKHOLE".....you are really working on a 'mud pond'...lol...i am jealous....Billy

fishin4cars
11-08-2013, 12:47 AM
LOL, Billy, The sink hole is down by the river, Not anywhere close to the mudpond, and it's stopped growing and has dried up completely. The ground up where the mud pond is being dug is hard clay. I did take a bunch of the dirt from the dig down to that area and fill in the area near the sinkhole area. It's just soft sand under there and some rotting roots and wash away from when the river floods. Nothing like the sinkholes that make the news... LOL

CrazyKoiWoman69
05-17-2014, 07:46 AM
For a mud pond do you need special filters or aerator sand stuff? Someone let me know I think I would like to put one in.

BWG
05-18-2014, 11:45 AM
Not an easy question to answer without a lot more information. You can have an excellent mud pond with no aeration or flow through water if you let it achieve natural balance with stocking levels and minimal feeding. A lot depends on soil types and quality of water filling the pond (excess nutrients) . Generally speaking for a nice back yard pond line all of the banks with gravel to prevent erosion and provide aeration. I have a low cost airlift mud pond aerator in another thread. If you don't have enough runoff water to keep the pond full then water from an external source such as a well will be needed. In my area a ratio of 4 to 1 is needed for surface drainage to pond surface to keep full. This ratio will vary by soil types and available rain so get local advice. With Koi you will never have a clear natural pond as they like to continually stir things up on the bottom. Extremely small mud ponds are rarely successful.

Our county agriculture extension service gives free pond assessment and planning.

CrazyKoiWoman69
06-01-2014, 11:26 AM
Well I wouldn't want it small. But thanks for that info. I do plan on aeration as I have found it a necessity in all my fishtanks/pools/ponds. I also have a natural stream right here to draw water from instead of my city water and the area is a large back yard. I dont want to put in a filtered system (clear pond) yet as I am moving soon and wont be here longer than a few months maybe. I just need to make sure its not under or too close to the pear tree!:eek1: Those thing would hurt if they fell on the Koi.:no:
It wouldnt be overstocked I only have 2 large koi at 11 and 13" form Sarah and 3 about 8-10 inches. Russell has 2 that are in QT with him....If I have to have him hold them a little longer I will and just pay him for some costs of found and meds and housing etc.... I dont want to take advantage of his generosity.
I have a couple in an indoor tank that are 6-7 inches that would go in the small prefabbed pond. and I have a large basement pooll and a smaller pool and large tubs. LOL I have space but they really need to be outside.:yes: I find that most of them are not happy indoors.