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    Thread: Medications And Treatments List

    1. #1
      cindy's Avatar
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      Medications And Treatments List

      in the works. I'll pull my Duncan, Dr. J and Doc Nick books and get a chart going of recommended treatments. A work in progress.

      with any treatment, increase oxygen

      This is a partial list, invest in the books.

      Dr. Johnson "Koi Health and Disease" a must have - available at koivetbooks.com

      Step by Step Advanced Koi Diagnois & Treatments - Duncan Griffith ( stays on my desk)
      order at www.koi-unleashed.co.uk

      Advanced Koi Care By Dr. Nicholas Saint-Erne http://www.usakoi.com/Advanced-Koi-C...Ds-sc-729.html
      Last edited by cindy; 07-14-2010 at 11:34 AM.
      My opinions in ER and on this forum are mine only. Use my advice at your own discretion.

      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."


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    2. #2
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      WHITE SPOT (Ichthyophthiriasis Multifilis) Ich
      White spot can't be touched with chemicals while its embedded and when it changes into the white salt looking cyst. We need to kill it when it leaves the fish and falls to the bottom
      . It is temperature dependant

      Karl S (from our ER sticky)
      Known as white spot. Easily seen on the body with the naked eye. The problem often experienced with koi is that it is only on the gills and so is not observed except for symptoms of flashing like so many other parasite infestations. Salt at .6% along with an increase in temperatures usually is enough to eradicate them. ProformC also is an effective treatment with an increase in temperature. Ich also is known to become quite active during barometric swings. The Florida fish farmers nearly always treat their fish for Ich following a strong thunderstorm

      The following treatment is suggested by many: Three treatments, daily with 25% water changes before each treatment. On the third dose combine ProformC and Praziquantel and allow to stand for seven days Another treatment should be considered after seven days AFTER a 25% water change.. A small percentage of salt in the water will not affect the treatment or the fish. This treatment is for all parasites and it is temperature/life cycle dependent.

      Malachite Green Stock Solution
      15 grams makes one gallon. Thereafter use one drop per gallon. This is a great Ich treatment when combined with increased temperature for a few days. It has been used for many years by accomplished aquarists on their collections as well as fish farmers in Florida. For those with planted aquaria or ponds the plants seem to suffer no harm.




      Duncan (us dose) Malachite green 2% 10 ml per 212 gallons
      Formalin 30 % 10 ml per 180 gallons
      (UK dose) MG 2% 10 ml per 176 gal
      Formalin 30% 10 ml per 150 gal

      Treat with MG&F as abouve 3 times leaving 5 clear days in between treatments with at least one 15% partial water change between each dose. Treat as abouve on days 1, 7, and 13

      KMnO4 (PP) is also effectice against white spot at 1.5 ppm for 3 treatments leaving a minimum of 4 clear days between treatments.

      Salt also works when accompanied with heat. Salt at .6% and raise the temp to 71-74 degrees F.


      Dr. J (Koivet)
      1. Remove valued live plants.
      2. Raise temperature to 80 degrees, tops.
      3. Increase aeration!
      4. Add one teaspoon of salt per gallon.
      5. Twelve hours later, add another one teaspoon of salt per gallon.
      6. Twelve hours later, add another one teaspoon of salt per gallon.
      7. Within 48-60 hours of the second salt dose at 80 degrees, the Ich will be gone.
      8. Leave salt in the water for another 3-5 days unless you're worried about your live plants.
      9. Remove salt via partial waterchanges. (30-40% at a time if desired).


      --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

      Dr. Nick....
      Last edited by cindy; 07-14-2010 at 11:05 AM.
      My opinions in ER and on this forum are mine only. Use my advice at your own discretion.

      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."


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    3. #3
      cindy's Avatar
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      COSTIA

      Dr. Johnson from Koivet:
      [/B]
      http://koivet.com/a_costia.html

      Salt:
      During and after your treatment of Costia with salt at zero-point-three-percent, it is imperative that you serially biopsy your specimens to make sure the numbers of Costial organisms are decreasing or are absent. If you're still seeing Costial organisms after 72 hours in zero-point-three-percent salt, some level of resistance can be assumed. At that point you should either increase the salt concentration to zero-point-six-percent to-zero-point-nine-percent or consider Formalin. You should not use Formalin at fifty PPM with the higher levels of salt. I have used zero-point-three-percent salt and left it in during Formalin treatments. This has caused no problems in cooler water with high circulatory rates. I caution you that stiff (zero-point-nine-percent) salt solutions coupled with Formalin might create an oxygen availability/transfer problem. All oxygen tension problems become more acute under conditions of warm water, e.g. water over eighty DGF

      Formalin is the best treatment for salt resistant Costia.

      The general idea of this Formalin treatment is to apply fifty PPM Formalin (two milliliters(equivalent to cc) per ten gallons) to a tank with the filter bypassed. Increase circulation with a floom or with a spraybar. Run this level of Formalin for two hours and then execute a forty to fifty percent water change, with de-chlorinator. Repeat the treatment in 72 hours. Do this Formalin treatment for a total of three treatments and you can rid your system of Costia and Flukes.
      [/SIZE]

      Karl S Costia is easily eradicated by applying heat. At 87*F. Costia is immobilized and can no longer reproduce. It only takes a few days for all to die. Unfortunately most pond settings do not allow for heat to applied to this degree. For those situations ProformC will work well. It is a formaldehyde and malachite green solution safe enough to be shipped without HazMat fees and is quite effective. The dosage may be increased slightly without fear to allow for errors in calculating the gallonage of the pond. Prior to dosing a 25 to 50% water change is advised to reduce the organics and improve performance of the chemical. see treatment for ich

      Duncan -see treatment dosages for white spot bt with only 2 sequential treatments, is very effective. Costia is usually gone on the first pass, 2nd treatment takes care of problem bugs.

      Fishbreeder
      Proform C apparently does not work all that well, I hear the same tale again and again.What works for me at my farm...I use 50 ppm of formalin and 0.1 ppm of malachite green for one hour, then 25 ppm formalin and 0.1 ppm malachite green for one more hour, then the costia are gone.To do this...Using regular formalin (37% fromaldehyde) put 20 ml per 100 USG of storage capacity (pond plus filters). You must circulate the treatment through the filters. Using stock solution of MG....Make stock solution by adding exactly 14.5 grams of MG to one gallon of water and dissolve. Using this stock solution, add 10 ml per 100 USG storage capacity to the pond that has the formalin already added.Wait one hour. Remove exactly half the pond water and replace. This brings the formalin concentration down to 25 ppm and the MG down to 0.05 ppm.. Now, you add back another 5 ml per 100 USG of the MG stock solution to bring the concentration back to 0.1 ppm. Wait one hour and change half the water again. Costia will be gone.Another scenario is to add 10 ml per 100 USG of formalin as well as 10 ml per 100 USG of the MG and let it sey in the water fro 24 hours then change out about 40% of the water.Disclaimer: If you kill your fish, you killed your fish, not me. Nobody has to do anything I say, you take this advice, cause a problem, you got a problem.Brett
      Last edited by cindy; 07-15-2010 at 12:57 PM.
      My opinions in ER and on this forum are mine only. Use my advice at your own discretion.

      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."


      K.O.I.

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    4. #4
      The Juice is offline Member
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      Good idea for a sticky.

    5. #5
      cindy's Avatar
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      definitely, I have this all on one sheet, must be home in my ER binder. Probably needed updating anyway but I'll compare.
      My opinions in ER and on this forum are mine only. Use my advice at your own discretion.

      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."


      K.O.I.

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    6. #6
      cindy's Avatar
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      chilodonella

      Karl S Chilo is easily eradicated with salt at .6%. This salt treatment has an overall duration of 14 days. There are no ill effects using salt at this level. After the treatment is complete a series of water changes should be completed to slowly reduce the salt level to just that of the raw(incoming)water.

      Chilo may also be treated as above (ProformC) for Costia. Either treatment will be effective but in the case of formaldehyde it is important that the organics(dirty water-poor water quality)be removed somewhat with a minimum 25% water change to improve the performance of the chemical.


      Dr. J Chilodinella clears EASILY with salt. .3% Leave the salt in for 14 days, and be sure to supplement aeration, as gill damage d/t Chilodinella may be severe in the survivors. Chilodinella should be suspected anytime large numbers of fish are dying on the surface, or who roll over on their sides except when disturbed, the Koi dash madly adding Karls update:Chilodonella will clear with .6% salt over a treatment time of 14 days. If water changes need to be done during that time, remember to add salt back to .6%.

      Duncan same MG & F treatment for white spot - extra air as always
      Last edited by cindy; 07-15-2010 at 12:59 PM.
      My opinions in ER and on this forum are mine only. Use my advice at your own discretion.

      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."


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    7. #7
      cindy's Avatar
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      trichodina

      Dr J Trichodina’s other ‘special ability’ is its occasional resistance to salt at 0.3%. Indeed, there are few cases wherein salt does not clear up this parasite, but when this occurs, it can be serious. In most instances of salt resistance, double and triple salt levels clear the pathogen. You should be aware that otherwise healthy fish will survive salt levels up to 0.9% [zero-point-nine percent] which is achieved with three tablespoons of salt per gallon

      Duncan One single pass of 1.5 ppm KMnO4 is used to eradicate this parasite as long as you can maintain at least 2 to 3 hours purple water

      PP UK dose 1.5 gm per 220 gallons US Dose 1.5 gm per 264 gallons

      The standard dose of M G & F will also eradicate Trich. Again extra air is recommended


      Karl S Trichodina can be treated with .6% salt much the same as Chilo and Ick. Again I would suggest 14 days at .6%. This will not harm the fish and most likely will eradicate Trichy.

      As is often the case a safe alternative which is proven effective is ProformC. Using the label directions for three treatments over three days with 25% water changes each day is effective but I like to add a final ProformC treatment and let it stand for a few days before scraping and scoping for remaining parasites.

      I know that Potassium Permanganate can be very effective on this and many other parasites. The problem in suggesting it is that few people actually know the true number of gallons(or litres)in their pond or quarantine tank. So I would suggest that we stay with what will work, and is fairly safe overall.
      Last edited by cindy; 07-15-2010 at 11:12 PM.
      My opinions in ER and on this forum are mine only. Use my advice at your own discretion.

      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."


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    8. #8
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      flukes

      Gill flukes are egg layers, harder to kill. Skin flukes carry a fully formed fluke inside, get the parent, get the baby.

      Karl S: Praziquantel: Gill and Skin Flukes: Praziquantel must be ingested by the fluke to work. The dosage is one gram per 100 gallons of water. Currently the directions suggest using level tablespoons to measure the product. That is a mistake. In my experience a level tablespoon may hold anywhere from 2.5 to 4.5 grams of product. Not only is this wasteful and inaccurate; it is also very expensive. Please use a gram scale. Calibrate it often.

      Since it does not mix readily with water a label dosage ProformC may be used, or it can be dosed with the ProformC as part of the treatment described above. Once it is fully dissolved it does not seem to filter out or precipitate. It simply degrades over time. When using Praziquantel, the water temperature should be in the mid-seventies(US). The first and all succeeding treatments should last seven days each whether treating for gill flukes(Dactylogyrus) or skin flukes(Gyrodactylus). 25% water changes should be made between treatments. Redosing will immediately bring it to the strength needed to kill flukes. I strongly recommend a third or even fourth application of this product due to the life cycle of the flukes as well as the thickness of the slime coat on Koi. In colder waters (60*F to 70*F) a fourth application is usually necessary when treating for gill flukes. Because of the cost of Praziquantel and the reduced treatment time it is well worth the effort to bring the temperature up to optimum. Another way to reduce cost is to simply lower the water in the container or pond to be treated.

      Organphosphates-Fluke Tabs:Fluke Tabs work well in waters where the Kh is less than 170ppm. Above that the poison is bound by the water and becomes ineffective. Attempts at double and triple dosing in high Kh waters results in killing the flukes AND the fish.

      Fenbendazole:
      An older type dewormer which seems to work at times, the dosage is 1 gram per 100 gallons and is used the same way as Praziquantel.

      Duncan Supaverm UK 1 ml per 100 gallons US 1 ml per 120 gallons*Supaverm can burn koi* recommend the UK dosage

      Flubenol 5% (pig wormer) Supaverm is a sheep wormer Comes in a powder must be dissolved in acetone - dosage pending

      doc J: Control of flukes has become increasingly easy with contemporary medicine. Potassium permanganate has been shown to be effective when applied as an eight hour bath at one gram per hundred gallons (2 ppm) or when dosed daily at 2 ppm for five days consecutively. Alternatively, some have found that despite it's negative effects on fish and filter, that Formalin is effective in eradication of fluke adults, with a second treatment (three days later) serving as clean-up for the emerging young. Droncit Tablets from the Veterinarian are superb at clearing Flukes in stable, heavily planted Discus tanks, and finally, Fluke Tabs® (Aquarium Products, Glen Burnie MD) have also shown strong effect in warmer water at one tablet per ten gallons applied in two treatments 4 days apart.
      PRAZI WORKS THE VERY http://koivet.com/a_flukes_koi_parasite.html
      Last edited by cindy; 07-14-2010 at 04:30 PM.
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    9. #9
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      FISH LICE AND ANCHOR WORM

      One word - Dimilin
      Karl
      Diflubenzuron 25% wettable powder:

      Actually this is an insecticide for greenhouse use. This powder works well in eradicating anchor worm(Lernea)and fish lice(Argulus). One gram will treat 3000 gallons. It is quite forgiving and an overdose usually will not cause irrepairable harm. The parasites should be removed by soaking them in iodine and pulling them carefully with a tweezers. Sedating the fish will prevent uncontrolled thrashing and further damage to the fish during this process. No ill effect is noted from sedation.

      There are liquid forms (Dimilin) on the market. Follow the label directions.
      Last edited by cindy; 07-15-2010 at 01:02 PM.
      My opinions in ER and on this forum are mine only. Use my advice at your own discretion.

      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."


      K.O.I.

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    10. #10
      cindy's Avatar
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      I'll bring my Dr. st.ernes book in the am
      My opinions in ER and on this forum are mine only. Use my advice at your own discretion.

      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."


      K.O.I.

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    11. #11
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      Nice to see this updating. Thank you Cindy!
      How about info on Bacterial Gill Disease?
      Still learning as I go but y'all can call me Marilyn

    12. #12
      cindy's Avatar
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      will do, starting with parasites and I'll move on to ulcers and bacterial
      My opinions in ER and on this forum are mine only. Use my advice at your own discretion.

      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."


      K.O.I.

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    13. #13
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      very very helpful....thanks Cindy. Maybe a sticky for each pathogen?
      Jorge

    14. #14
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      Doc Johnson's usage of .3% salt to clear Chilodonella is outdated. That's the problem with books. By the time they are printed and distributed they are out of date. Keep that in mind when you are reading of referring to koi health books. Chilodonella will clear with .6% salt over a treatment time of 14 days. If water changes need to be done during that time, remember to add salt back to .6%.

      Karl
      Karl Schoeler, founder: EIHIOICGI

      Certified: AKCA Better Health Practices December 2008




      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."

    15. #15
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      Diflubenzuron 25% wettable powder:

      Actually this is an insecticide for greenhouse use. This powder works well in eradicating anchor worm(Lernea)and fish lice(Argulus). One gram will treat 3000 gallons. It is quite forgiving and an overdose usually will not cause irrepairable harm. The parasites should be removed by soaking them in iodine and pulling them carefully with a tweezers. Sedating the fish will prevent uncontrolled thrashing and further damage to the fish during this process. No ill effect is noted from sedation.

      There are liquid forms (Dimilin) on the market. Follow the label directions.
      Karl Schoeler, founder: EIHIOICGI

      Certified: AKCA Better Health Practices December 2008




      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."

    16. #16
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      Thought I would add this from Brett RE:Costia....


      Fishbreeder Resident fisheries biologist Join Date: Dec 2004Location: Liverpool, TexasPosts: 331

      Proform C apparently does not work all that well, I hear the same tale again and again.What works for me at my farm...I use 50 ppm of formalin and 0.1 ppm of malachite green for one hour, then 25 ppm formalin and 0.1 ppm malachite green for one more hour, then the costia are gone.To do this...Using regular formalin (37% fromaldehyde) put 20 ml per 100 USG of storage capacity (pond plus filters). You must circulate the treatment through the filters. Using stock solution of MG....Make stock solution by adding exactly 14.5 grams of MG to one gallon of water and dissolve. Using this stock solution, add 10 ml per 100 USG storage capacity to the pond that has the formalin already added.Wait one hour. Remove exactly half the pond water and replace. This brings the formalin concentration down to 25 ppm and the MG down to 0.05 ppm.. Now, you add back another 5 ml per 100 USG of the MG stock solution to bring the concentration back to 0.1 ppm. Wait one hour and change half the water again. Costia will be gone.Another scenario is to add 10 ml per 100 USG of formalin as well as 10 ml per 100 USG of the MG and let it sey in the water fro 24 hours then change out about 40% of the water.Disclaimer: If you kill your fish, you killed your fish, not me. Nobody has to do anything I say, you take this advice, cause a problem, you got a problem.Brett
      The will of God will not take you where the grace of God cannot keep you. .....
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    17. #17
      cindy's Avatar
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      thank you, I'll add all the advise.

      I know doc j used to use salt for everything and it worked till the bugs got salt resistant.

      I forgot my St. Ernes book.
      My opinions in ER and on this forum are mine only. Use my advice at your own discretion.

      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."


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    18. #18
      cindy's Avatar
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      Karl, I didn't see your treatment for trich
      My opinions in ER and on this forum are mine only. Use my advice at your own discretion.

      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."


      K.O.I.

      Member: EIHIOICGI

      http://www.koiphen.com/forums/showth...nd-Information

      http://www.koiphen.com/forums/showth...06#post2606106 Show thread

    19. #19
      KoiValley's Avatar
      KoiValley is offline WWKC Lifetime Diamond Member #3 -
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      Quote Originally Posted by cindy View Post
      Karl, I didn't see your treatment for trich
      Here it is:

      Trichodina can be treated with .6% salt much the same as Chilo and Ick. Again I would suggest 14 days at .6%. This will not harm the fish and most likely will eradicate Trichy.

      As is often the case a safe alternative which is proven effective is ProformC. Using the label directions for three treatments over three days with 25% water changes each day is effective but I like to add a final ProformC treatment and let it stand for a few days before scraping and scoping for remaining parasites.

      I know that Potassium Permanganate can be very effective on this and many other parasites. The problem in suggesting it is that few people actually know the true number of gallons(or litres)in their pond or quarantine tank. So I would suggest that we stay with what will work, and is fairly safe overall.
      Karl Schoeler, founder: EIHIOICGI

      Certified: AKCA Better Health Practices December 2008




      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."

    20. #20
      andres58's Avatar
      andres58 is offline Senior Member
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      How about some pictures associated with each parasite for identification?....great work guys......
      Jorge

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