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    Thread: Shiro Utsuri red blood vessels, not eating, hiding

    1. #1
      srphoenix is offline Junior Member
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      Shiro Utsuri red blood vessels, not eating, hiding

      Hi everyone, I've searched and tried several different things with no solution or help yet.

      I have a 24-30" shiro utsuri that is probably 5-6 years old that stopped eating about a month ago now. We are moving to a new home so they are currently in a 12ft intex pool setup, but he was doing this while in their normal basement pond that they've been in for years. I've tried bsdt shotgun treatments, salt baths, sebactissun, and api ulcer treatments and nothing has worked. I pulled him from the pond while doing the salt baths and checked for an obstruction in his mouth, but nothing there either. All of the other fish are doing perfect and my water quality is really good at the moment with 0 ammonia and fully established filters now.

      As a recap of his symptoms, she has red blood vessels, not eating, hiding on bottom or under plant baskets, sometimes clamped fins.

      Does anyone have any other ideas or thoughts on what might be going on with this fish? I know it's pretty tough to see in strong detail through the netting over the pond and the reflections, but here are two pictures:

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      Thank you tremendously for any help!

    2. #2
      icu2's Avatar
      icu2 is online now Administrator ~ WWKC Treasurer
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      On the BSDT treatments, you did all 3 treatments and did you do a treatment for flukes with Fluke-M or Prazi with the last one?

      pH swing in the morning and evening?
      --Steve
      Find more about Weather in Poulsbo, WA

      "It is far better to be alone, than to be in bad company." --George Washington

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      Thanks for the reply Steve. I used a microbe lift broad spectrum disease treatment. Turns everything green. I would have thought the salt baths would nuke any parasites though right?

      pH has been super stable in this new pond as it's off a well and stays at like 8.5. we had a lot of rain recently but this has been going on for about a month so I don't think the rain is the cause. I'll double check the pH though to see if it dropped at all

    4. #4
      icu2's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by srphoenix View Post
      Thanks for the reply Steve. I used a microbe lift broad spectrum disease treatment. Turns everything green. I would have thought the salt baths would nuke any parasites though right?

      pH has been super stable in this new pond as it's off a well and stays at like 8.5. we had a lot of rain recently but this has been going on for about a month so I don't think the rain is the cause. I'll double check the pH though to see if it dropped at all
      Depends on the concentration and the parasites, but many say most parasites have grown resistant to salt due to its overuse.
      BSDT = Broad Spectrum Disease Treatment
      It should be used to treat for 3 days in a row with water changes in between days. On the 3rd dose it can be combined with a treatment for
      flukes that I mentioned and left with no water changes for 7 days. I usually treat again just for flukes after the 7 days and a water change
      because if they have gill flukes, another dose will kill any eggs that hatch.
      --Steve
      Find more about Weather in Poulsbo, WA

      "It is far better to be alone, than to be in bad company." --George Washington

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      Thanks again Steve, so your thinking it's flukes going on? I'll try and setup a makeshift qt pond so I don't have to mess with the good bio in the main pond.

      I'll let you know how it goes. Thanks again for the help!

    6. #6
      icu2's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by srphoenix View Post
      Thanks again Steve, so your thinking it's flukes going on? I'll try and setup a makeshift qt pond so I don't have to mess with the good bio in the main pond.

      I'll let you know how it goes. Thanks again for the help!
      Honestly without a microscope and doing a scrape and scope, we're shotgunning it. But when I shotgun I figure might as
      well cover as many possibilities as I can. Also, do the whole pond when using BSDT and the fluke treatment. Don't
      move him to a QT. I've used both treatments many times and never had it effect my bio filter. You want to treat all the fish and
      filters. Do an initial water change (the cleaner the water, the better the BSDT will work) of at least 25% before the first treatment.
      If you use any carbon filters remove them before treating and replace the carbon. When using the fluke treatment, turn off any
      UV and bypass any foam fractionator.
      --Steve
      Find more about Weather in Poulsbo, WA

      "It is far better to be alone, than to be in bad company." --George Washington

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      Hey Steve, did the bsdt as well as perozyne (sp? Its the microbe lift herbal parasite treatment), and two doses of the prazi and the red blotches are starting to go away. She's swimming better with the others and even took a couple nibbles at the sinking food for the first time in a month!

      Just wanted to say a huge thank you! She's not totally out of the woods yet, but making a lot of progress. Thanks again!!

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      She took a turn for the worst unfortunately. I think there may have been some other underlying issue affecting her health as she kept developing other issues and finally the stress of a huge thunderstorm last night caused her to float belly up on the surface revealing a large cottony looking ulcer in addition to the red spots all over. I didn't want to put her through anymore pain so used clove oil to put her to sleep until she 100% stopped breathing and then gave her the final sendoff over the nearby waterfall. She was a good fish and we will miss her.

      Thanks again for all the advice though Steve, I learned a lot through the process of treating her that will hopefully save any of my other fish should an issue arise.

      Here's a good shot of her from a couple years ago:

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    9. #9
      icu2's Avatar
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      I'm so sorry.
      --Steve
      Find more about Weather in Poulsbo, WA

      "It is far better to be alone, than to be in bad company." --George Washington

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