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    Thread: PP the hydrogen peroxide, where is the sparkling water?

    1. #1
      MovingTarget is offline Senior Member
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      PP the hydrogen peroxide, where is the sparkling water?

      I have an 8k gallon pond. Per the calculator on this site, I added 61 grams of PP to hit 2.0, waited 2 hours, did it again, waited 2 hours and added 8 pints of hydrogen peroxide to my stream, took about 2+ hours, dark brown is mostly gone but I thought the water should be gin clear and I can't see the bottom. I bypassed the bead filter during the entire process, turned it back on about 4 hours after adding the HP. I had the waterfall and two bottom drains air going the whole time.

      Should I add more HP tomorrow? What did I do wrong?Name:  IMG_0844.jpg
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    2. #2
      Billy's Avatar
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      It looks like you still have doc's.

      Other Sites Sale prices are our everyday prices.
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    3. #3
      montwila's Avatar
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      PP is not a cure all. It will begin to oxidize everything it touches. However it is only 61 grams. If you could not see the bottom of your pond to begin with then you cannot expect 61 grams to oxidize all of the material suspended in the pond. In 8000 gallons of water and not being able to see the bottom I would suspect you have well over a pound or several pounds of "flocculent" material suspended in the water.

      People say that PP will clean up the water but the water must be fairly clean to begin with. It is more for polishing clean water than actually cleaning dirty water.

      The H2O2 will last about three days before you can try again and it may also polish the water a little more over the next day. But as Billy says: it still looks like you have some stuff to clean up.

    4. #4
      MovingTarget is offline Senior Member
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      Hmm okay. So any suggestions on what the next round should look like?

    5. #5
      MovingTarget is offline Senior Member
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      Quote Originally Posted by montwila View Post
      PP is not a cure all. It will begin to oxidize everything it touches. However it is only 61 grams. If you could not see the bottom of your pond to begin with then you cannot expect 61 grams to oxidize all of the material suspended in the pond. In 8000 gallons of water and not being able to see the bottom I would suspect you have well over a pound or several pounds of "flocculent" material suspended in the water.

      People say that PP will clean up the water but the water must be fairly clean to begin with. It is more for polishing clean water than actually cleaning dirty water.

      The H2O2 will last about three days before you can try again and it may also polish the water a little more over the next day. But as Billy says: it still looks like you have some stuff to clean up.

      It was 61 grams x2 since I did this twice.

    6. #6
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      What is your filtration?

      If you were to throw a bucket of dirt into the pond a PP treatment would not clear it up.

      When you say "pint" do you mean 16 ounces? i.e. the small size rather than the larger size (32 ounce) bottles of 3% HP

    7. #7
      icu2's Avatar
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      I'm with Monte. It won't cure other issues that are causing clarity problems. Or if it does temporarily
      they probably will return until the actual filtration problem is cured.
      When I treat with low dose and not trying to treat something specific with the PP I don't retreat for another week.
      I use my low dose (1-2ppm) and clear with HP and see how it did. If it needs more it'll have to wait till next week.

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    8. #8
      ricshaw's Avatar
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      Is the bead filter your only filtration?

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      Aerated bottom drains will also keep fine particulate in suspension longer. They help moving larger particles on the bottom but at the expense of continually circulating fines.

    10. #10
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      Quote Originally Posted by audioenvy View Post
      What is your filtration?

      If you were to throw a bucket of dirt into the pond a PP treatment would not clear it up.

      When you say "pint" do you mean 16 ounces? i.e. the small size rather than the larger size (32 ounce) bottles of 3% HP
      I mean pint. I put in four big bottles which where each a quart and there are two pints in a quart.

    11. #11
      MovingTarget is offline Senior Member
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      Quote Originally Posted by ricshaw View Post
      Is the bead filter your only filtration?
      Yes. I have two bottom drains and a skimmer that feeds a Sacramento koi 15 bead filter and a Uv

    12. #12
      MovingTarget is offline Senior Member
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      Before anyone asks, I have 13 koi that average 10”

    13. #13
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      Quote Originally Posted by MovingTarget View Post
      Yes. I have two bottom drains and a skimmer that feeds a Sacramento koi 15 bead filter and a Uv
      That's a decent setup. How often do you backflush with air and what is your turnover rate?

    14. #14
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      I usually do 3ppm ( 85gram for 7500 gallon pond), leave it for 3-4 hours and use 2 -32oz HP, turn back my filters after about 20 mins after dosing HP. On the 4th day, I backwash my sand/Gravel filters, then bypass them and repeat the same process with PP and HP and I usually have crystal water water after that.

      My $.02, your 2 time x 2ppm might not be consistent since it would range between 0 to 4 ppm depends on how fast that PP gets consumed by your water.
      Tony

    15. #15
      Roddy Conrad's Avatar
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      61 grams in 8000 gallons is 2 ppm dose. My rule of thumb on 2 ppm doses is to keep repeating them until the purple/pink color lasts at least an hour before the water turns dark brown. The first time I do this, even in a fairly clean pond with reasonably clear water, it "usually" takes 4 repeat 2 ppm doses until I am satisfied that the repeat doses have cleaned up the water well enough to stop PP dosing. Sometimes it takes 4 doses per day for two or three days until the water has been really cleaned up, particularly if there is much sludge in the filter system. Ideally I dump the sludge out of the settling tanks with a big water change a day or two before starting a PP cleanup so it does not take so much PP to clean it up.

      I never turn off the filters when dosing at 2 ppm. I want the PP to clean up the filters some, too. With a decent filter system, there is seldom a problem with the biofiltration after repeat PP treatments.

      I prefer to reverse the PP with sodium thiosulfate after the last dose that lasted an hour or more, then use a little peroxide to clean the water of the brown color the next day, letting the filter system remove the brown manganese dioxide solids first.

      The usual reason I use PP is not for water clarity but to reduce bacteria count in the water so the koi stay healthier, particularly around spawning season when the females get pretty beat up and need protection from developing ulcers from high water bacteria counts. My new avatar is from a picture of me in January 2018 holding a new puppy I picked up in Tulsa, Oklahoma. His name is Wookie, his father is Chewbacca in the Star Wars movie series.
      Last edited by Roddy Conrad; 2 Weeks Ago at 11:55 AM.
      Still working at a big chemical plant full time at age 77 now. Still using potassium permanganate to regularly clean up the pond and the koi. Have developed a package of age regression technology to become younger instead of older. Doing great!

    16. #16
      icu2's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Roddy Conrad View Post
      My new avatar is from a picture of me in January 2018 holding a new puppy I picked up in Tulsa, Oklahoma. His name is Wookie, his father is Chewbacca in the Star Wars movie series.
      Good to see you posting Roddy! Wookie is adorable!
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    17. #17
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      Nice to hear from You Roddy

    18. #18
      Roddy Conrad's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by icu2 View Post
      Good to see you posting Roddy! Wookie is adorable!
      In the January picture, Wookie was 8 weeks old and weighed 12 pounds. Now he is 6 months old and weighs 60 pounds, expected mature weight of 120 pounds at three years.

      But he is still as handsome at 6 months as he was at 8 weeks. Wookie is a pure bred Bouvier des Flanders dog from a fine breeding program. Blond Bouviers are quite rare, and Wookie is blessed with lovely blond body, an interesting face, and perfect confirmation. But mostly he is a real joy to have around, the most pleasant dog we have ever had.
      Last edited by Roddy Conrad; 2 Weeks Ago at 02:32 PM.
      Still working at a big chemical plant full time at age 77 now. Still using potassium permanganate to regularly clean up the pond and the koi. Have developed a package of age regression technology to become younger instead of older. Doing great!

    19. #19
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      Quote Originally Posted by icu2 View Post
      Good to see you posting Roddy! Wookie is adorable!
      Ditto! Hope you hang around for a while ( :

      And, your age regression package ... can I hear more? I am currently ageing backwards, we can compare notes!
      ________________________________________

      Cheers,
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    20. #20
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      I have always followed Roddy's protocol, either at 1 ppm or 2 ppm, usually also for bacterial cleanup. If I see a red spot on any of my koi, I do a treatment, and usually by the next day the spot is gone. Had Roddy not posted, I would have referred you to two of the threads where he posts about PP use and sodium bicarbonate use. I either stop the reaction with dechlorinator, or just let it go to completion. Very rarely do I ever use hydrogen peroxide, unless I need that super clear water for a visitation. And that is after the several rounds of PP!

      Thanks for being here Roddy, we missed you! Glad you have a wonderful Bouvier; sounds like he will be a big dog, good to have a great personality in that size!!!


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