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    Thread: Sick pond needs help

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    1. #1
      ThanhT is offline Member
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      Unhappy Sick pond needs help

      I am new to this site and hope someone can help me.
      Ten days ago I moved 4 small Koi from a 1000 gallons pond to a larger 3200-3500 gallons pond and few days later most my Koi were sick. Start out with two flashing and rubbing then four in the evening. Next day they looked a little pink and one seemed to turn a little white on his body, I thought they had parasite attack so went to the nearby dealer and bought the Proform C treated 3 days with 32 oz bottle changed water 80% prior the 1st. dose and 25% prior to 2nd. and 3rd. doses, fish were so stress and unhappy but no improvement. Now haft of my Koi laying on pond floor and other haft swim slowly. Today 2 Koi still flashing and 2 die. I realize that the Proform C was not the right one and don't know what to do next. Can I add salt and/or prazi for fluke?
      Please give advise and help me fix this thing.

      Thanks everyone in advance.

      Sincerely,

      Thanh.

    2. #2
      icu2's Avatar
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      Welcome ThanhT and I'm sorry for your troubles.
      I'll move your post to the Emergency Forum where more koi health care experts can help you.
      --Steve



      Koiphen 2021 Koi Person of the Year!

    3. #3
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      How long have you had them in the 1k pond?
      Is it your pond or someone else?

      Is the bigger pond established? Water qualities? Please provide testing numbers
      Any koi in the bigger pond before adding these 4 newbies?

      My guess is that the new koi still flash even after proform C then your next chance is Praziquantel for flukes
      But if you can bring your koi to a local dealer for scrape and scope would be ideal for diagnostic
      Salt probably won’t do any good for now
      M.Nguyen


    4. #4
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      So sorry for your losses.

      API makes great test kits. A good start is to get tests for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, KH, and a high range pH.

      http://www.cascade-pond-supply.com/T...ng-sc-443.html

      And I'd second OCKoi about needing more information about where the 4 fish came from and more about the 1000 and
      3500 gallon ponds.
      --Steve



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    5. #5
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      Thanks for your reply M. Nguyen. The water tested often and always good as of now:
      PH= 8.2-8.4
      Ammonia = 0.0
      Nitrite= 0.0
      Nitrate ??
      KH= 80
      temperature 56 degrees (was 58 few days ago)
      16 koi between 14"-18" in 3200-3500 gallons pond for 10-14 years, 11 small koi 10-12" the 1000 gallons pond also in the yard for at least 15 years. The 4 Koi I moved to the big pond were in the small pond just about 16 months. Three big koi now lay on bottom with clamped fins, they swim up sometimes and stay still in water with clamped fins and look sad.

      Thanks for your help.

      Best regards

      Thanh.

    6. #6
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      Base on your info
      I think you do have some knowledge on keeping koi, quarantine, treatments etc

      Some how the new koi may have transfered new bugs to the pond
      Scrape and scope is your best method to find the problem now

      Also try to the two prazi doses to be safe for meaning

      Keep your water optimal is very important
      Good luck
      M.Nguyen


    7. #7
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      I suspect Kh level is kinda low
      Try to raise it over 100 at least buy slowly
      I like my kh at 8 drops
      M.Nguyen


    8. #8
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      I appreciate your time and advise M. Nguyen. I am in a desperate confused and helpless mode any help would be helpful. I just check the water and to my surprise the ammonia read .5 and PH drop to 7.5 from 8.2 others parameter stay good as before. Changing 20-25% water now. Could the Proform C affected the water and dropped PH along with raising Ammonia? Because this situation has not occurred in the last 10 year or so except the first year and a haft of the pond.

      Thanks again wish you have a nice weekend.

      Sincerely,

      Thanh.

    9. #9
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      I don’t think Proform C caused Ph swing
      It the KH level
      Maintain kh over 100ppm prevent PH swing
      Ammonia present I’m not sure Proform C does somewhat to the bio but not that extreme
      M.Nguyen


    10. #10
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      There has been significant rainfall in the Bay Area. It’s very possible that lowered your KH level. OC is right, bind your ammonia and get your KH over 100. You’ve also depleted the KH processing ammonia. Your bio bacteria are using more alkalinity (KH) to do this at a time when the rain is also lowering the KH.

      Still learning as I go but y'all can call me Marilyn

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    11. #11
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      Thanh
      There are emergency stickies on top of the emergency forum
      If you need directions for adding baking soda to raise Kh
      Also there are many helpful information
      Yup Marilyn knows the Bay areas weather than anyone else
      M.Nguyen


    12. #12
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      Thanks all so much and yes it was 3-4" of rain fall in Bay area the last two days. I will check all water parameter as soon as the water change is completed (it takes about 2.5 to 3 hours to fill 20%-25% of the pond). will have you posted and please let me know anything you might come up with.

      You all have a nice day.

      Sincerely,

      Thanh.

    13. #13
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      When you retest the pond water, also test your tap water. It could be your tap water is lower in KH than your pond.
      Your results will tell us if water changes are raising or lowering your KH.

      Still learning as I go but y'all can call me Marilyn

    14. #14
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      Hi all,
      Just tested the pond and tap water together and found out why the ammonia in the pond up .5 in all of a sudden, city water has .5 ammonia. I changed 80% water Monday, 25% Tuesday and 25% Wednesday prior to each dose of Proform C and ended up with .5 ammonia from the tap water into the pond. The Ph swing due to the heavy rain the last 2-3 days. Tap water tested 5 drops of KH.

      I am not so sure but the conclusion is: We had parasite and the Proform C did its job but fish still sick due to the .5 ammonia together with the PH swing. I would love to hear your opinion and please post advises.

      Appreciate your help as always.

      Sincerely,

      Thanh.

    15. #15
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      If you have chloramine, instead of chloramine, the large changes in water are adding significant amounts of ammonia. Chloramine is chlorine with ammonia, and the chlorine is neutralized and the ammonia is bound. The bound ammonia is available to the filters for conversion to the nitrite and then nitrate, but there may be so much with the water changes that it has not been converted yet. Check the tap water for ammonia and it will tell you if you have chloramine. I would suggest use of an Ammonia Alert Card available from the local pet stores, as it will show whether the ammonia is bound and safe or unbound and toxic. If toxic, add some Prime, Safe, Chloram-X or whatever chloramine treatment.

      The fish will often continue to flash some following the Proform C treatment, but I have not seen the clamping continue, so I would treat with Prazi. Add it with one more dose of Proform C at 1.5 times normal dose. With the low temperatures, some of the parasites may have not been in a killable life cycle, but with a time delay, they could be now.
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    16. #16
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      Thanks so much. I add some prime now and will get prazi tomorrow and will treat it along with 1.5 doses of Proform C. Right now 2 koi having bodies turn pink and total of 5 koi on the pond's floor. mmmm.

      Thanks everyone.

      Thanh.

    17. #17
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      I got mild hit with PH swings 2 years ago
      Red streaks are visible on some of the white ground koi or fins
      So KH level definitely something to watch and tested monthly
      I lied....it’s been 4 months and I just did all the tests yesterday

      Rich show you the best trick to mix Proform C and prazi together
      They blend and mix much easier
      Prazi and water don’t do well
      You might have know this
      M.Nguyen


    18. #18
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      Thanks M. Nguyen. This is my first time using Prazi so will learn as it goes along.
      Have a nice Sunday.

      Thanh.

    19. #19
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      By the way, must I change any water prior to treating Prazi and after? I hope it is not required as I have been using too much water and the city here will be upset and a fine probably soon coming?

      Thanh.

    20. #20
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      A little vodka will also help the Prazi dissolve.
      --Steve



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