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    Thread: Minuta Seedlings!

    1. #1
      angieonthehill's Avatar
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      Minuta Seedlings!

      I was very pleased when I was offered some minuta seeds this year to try my hand at growing them out. I am very encouraged by the progress they are making. I planted the seeds a month ago and they are already sending up their first surface leaves. Though I would share a few photos. Attachment 570962

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      Your seedlings look great! Mine are not as far along but are doing well.
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      @Angie
      Wow very nice! So happy you get to enjoy this plant. Hopefully you should get blooms in a month!


      I am beginning to suspect that minuta germinates best damp but not submerged. I have seedlings almost a month old I started in water that have only 2 little leaves and are burning off. I started others out of the water in moist dirt a couple weeks ago and they are about the size of a half dollar. Minuta seems to crave the gas exchange like N thermarum.

      Fingers crossed but I should have floating leaves on 1 month old plants very soon.

      To those who don't know... I usually take 8-14 months to get minuta flowering age from seed. They usually stall out.

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      they look great
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    5. #5
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      Thanks to all for the encouragement. I checked my little plants when I returned home this evening and three more surface leaves had made their way up! I'll have to get up the nerve to separate the plants sometime soon. Any guidance would be appreciated as this is my first experience raising waterlilies from seed. Am looking forward to seeing those little flowers!

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      That is great! Any recent pics?
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      @Angie

      How to separate:
      I get multiple babies in one pot often. I use small pots/cups that I can easily fit in my hand. With those I invert the cup in water (pond or bucket) catching the plug of dirt/plant gently with my hands. Then with the dirt in the cup of my hand I wiggle my fingers underneath the dirt clod so as to gingerly knock of soil from the roots. Alternately you can gently dunk a dirt clod repeatedly. Now you should have a clump of plants with roots tangled that is clean enough of soil to float. You are going to hate me (Im 25 and this part hurts my back every time)... Next you try and find an individual plant in the matted mess. Gingerly grab the crown of that plant and tug in a very gentle pulsating manner. The trick to being gentle is to grip the plant very weakly. If you pull to hard you will let go of the plant essentially. At this point the individual plant should be somewhat separate from the mass. Now comb your fingers through its roots and pull individual fewer roots free of the main mass gently. The crucial thing is the water lubricates the roots and negates the gravity. If you try to tease the roots out on land they just rip. To save my back, if the plants are small enough I sit on the patio in a chair with a 5 gallon bucket of water rather than stooping over a pond getting nailed by mosquitoes.

      Since it looks like you have an awkwardly large container that you can't easily do the above... Maybe wait till the plants are flowering/bigger. If the plants where bigger then you could be less careful. If you were to accidentally rip a root the plant could take it. I would say just wait till your plants are bigger and possibly submerge your tub they are in now into a pond... use it as a "communal pot".


      Also I was hoping you could snap a zoomed out pic of where the tank/tub is now so as to glean more information as to why your plants are doing so well. There might be some detail/arbitrary decision that you made that greatly improves the performance of this plant. Or maybe if the camera is too much trouble, describe what you did. Your plants look great.
      Last edited by little_mikey; 07-28-2017 at 01:51 PM.

    8. #8
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      Thanks for all the info and suggestions Mikey. Here is the photo from today.
      I'm wondering if the N. minuta seeds are photo sensitive. They may have been triggered into germinating from the exclusion of light while in the mail. I know of other plant seeds that respond to those conditions (darkness). I didn't expect to see all those little sprouted seeds when I opened the package you sent! I had to do the best I could because I was leaving town the next day and had expected to start them when I returned a week and a half later. I put most of the seeds in a small tub about 6 inches square in sandy loam that had been rinsed and about three inches of rain water. The loam comes from 15 years of composted horse poop. My potting shed is in the stall where I kept my Morgan stallion that I rescued many years ago. I harvest rain water for my water gardening efforts. I kept about a dozen vigorous looking seeds in rain water and planted them individually encased in the clay (mine is red) "taco" you described when I returned home. They are not doing well. Only six of them are still viable and don't seem to be developing. All the seedlings are in the same light conditions, only morning and evening sun light, no direct midday sun. They stay shaded (in bright indirect sun light) a large part of the day.
      I think I will let the plants grow a little more and try to separate them using your submerged technique. That sounds like a good way to deal with such small delicate plants. I'm hoping to be successful growing these to maturity! Attachment 571027 And look what bloomed for me today Mikey!Attachment 571030
      Last edited by angieonthehill; 07-28-2017 at 08:59 PM.

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      Wow, cool bloom!

    10. #10
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      Minuta seedlings!

      Thanks! The bloom belongs to a Shirley Byrne baby (vip.) plant I recently received.
      Last edited by angieonthehill; 07-28-2017 at 08:58 PM. Reason: more info

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      @Angie
      That pic of the Shirley bryne has nice composition.

      That's interesting about the idea of photoperiod on germination. In a Japanese study on euryale ferrox light didn't matter much if I recall...Still would be worth trying.

      Also interesting about rainwater and organic loam... Kinda cans the idea I had about needing slightly alkaline Florida well water.

      FYI if you have floating leaves already you will have no issues getting them to maturity (they are basically there)...

      My verdict so far is that seedlings germinated damp or started on land grow much much faster.

    12. #12
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      I also am growing minuta seedlings. I planted my seeds before June 18th this yr. No floating leaves yet. I am zone 6 Missouri. I grew them the first time in 2005. And they lived for yrs. Even bloomed in my aquariums in the winter. But here they never bloomed till the next spring. And in the winter of 2006 and 2007. Bloomed in aquariums. I had them may yrs and finally lost them 2 yrs ago. I love them.

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      Glad you are back at it. Such a gem. If you don't mind, how did you loose them (paranoid about mine).

      I just made my first minuta cross this year. Excited to see the blooms. Want to take this new plant and eventually cross with a blue gigatnea....

    14. #14
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      Quote Originally Posted by RCPing View Post
      I also am growing minuta seedlings. I planted my seeds before June 18th this yr. No floating leaves yet. I am zone 6 Missouri. I grew them the first time in 2005. And they lived for yrs. Even bloomed in my aquariums in the winter. But here they never bloomed till the next spring. And in the winter of 2006 and 2007. Bloomed in aquariums. I had them may yrs and finally lost them 2 yrs ago. I love them.
      Thanks for sharing your experience keeping the N. minuta. I was going to set up an aquarium in my sun porch to keep them in over the winter. Did you keep them under lights? If so, do you remember what kind of bulb you kept in the hood fixture? I'm not sure my little plants will mature enough to bloom this year but it would be wonderful if they do. I hope yours do well too!

    15. #15
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      I can't say I am surprised the clay 'taco' failed. While some clay in the soil is desirable, according to Charles O. Masters is his book, 'Encyclopedia of the Water-Lily', a substate too heavy with clay binds the nutrients too tightly; to the extent they become unavailable to the plants.

      I also think you will find photoperiod is not a factor for tropical waterlilies. The Anecphya/Brachyceras have evolved over the eons in essentially equatorial zones, where the days/night periods are fairly evenly split. Hardy waterlilies are more temperate/boreal and they have adapted to shortening days and undergo physiological changes that make the rhizome more able to survive colder temperatures. For tropical Nymphaea the trigger for dormancy is primarily drought....the tubers being an adaptation to survive the dry periods.

      Again, to cite Masters....temperature is the more important factor in the tropical Nymphaea. And one reason in a litany of reasons that correct names are so important in dealing with waterlilies.....in a private conversation I enjoyed with Dr. Barre Hellquist at an IWGS symposium.....in his on site observations of the Aussie Nymphs, temperature actually becomes an ecological niche. N. gigantea is the first to emerge when the rains return....as the temperature increases, the gigantea growth suffers and N. immutability becomes the dominant species; but, as the temps approach 40 C ( 104 F ), it is N violacea that attains dominance. So the sellers that peddle N. 'Albert de Lestang' as every Aussie lily in the book are being deceptive and that lily ( which is actually now thought to be N. carpentaria, according to Carlos Magdelena of Kew Gardens, will not perform as promised as the temperatures change.

      Long way of saying, if you are growing seedlings, it is critical to know exactly what it is you are growing. Always ask for provable provenance. If I have time this week, I will try to provide some pictures of how I deal with seedlings.
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      Angie, the minuta seeds I received from Little Mikey are doing well also, I did not plant them as early as you did, so they are not as far along as yours. I did try a slight experiment, however. I divided the seeds into 4 small pots, planting the first two pots only a day apart. The last two pots were planted a week later. I placed the first pot in a slightly shaded part of the greenhouse, and the second pot was placed in a full sun, slightly warmer area. The shaded pot is outperforming the sunnier pot. A bigger difference is in the amazonum seeds. I divided the seeds in two pots, and again placed one pot in the shaded are, the other in the sunnier area. With the amazonum seeds, the shaded seeds sprouted well, but no sprouts are showing in the sunny pot. All seeds are the same and planted the same way. I will start future seeds in less heat and maybe less sun.
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      Thanks for all the information Craig. Any guidance would be greatly appreciated especially coming from you.
      The damp warm conditions in the mailing box must have been close to perfect for so many of the seeds to have germinated in the two day mail trip? I am glad I examined the seeds before I left town. It's likely they would have died before I returned.
      I am enjoying growing them what ever they turn out to be. Gives me a little confidence that I could actually grow some of my own hybrids from some of my waterlilies that I know for sure what they are (their provenance).

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      Thanks for letting me know how you started your seeds.
      Little Mikey asked if I would like some of the seeds he had available along with a couple of plants we had agreed to trade for.
      The N. minuta sounded interesting to me and he included some for me to try to grow. We'll see how they do, pretty good so far. Hoping for a bloom before the weather cools off.


      Quote Originally Posted by matherfish View Post
      Angie, the minuta seeds I received from Little Mikey are doing well also, I did not plant them as early as you did, so they are not as far along as yours. I did try a slight experiment, however. I divided the seeds into 4 small pots, planting the first two pots only a day apart. The last two pots were planted a week later. I placed the first pot in a slightly shaded part of the greenhouse, and the second pot was placed in a full sun, slightly warmer area. The shaded pot is outperforming the sunnier pot. A bigger difference is in the amazonum seeds. I divided the seeds in two pots, and again placed one pot in the shaded are, the other in the sunnier area. With the amazonum seeds, the shaded seeds sprouted well, but no sprouts are showing in the sunny pot. All seeds are the same and planted the same way. I will start future seeds in less heat and maybe less sun.

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      They just died over time. Maybe l should have grown more seeding. Instead I stored them dry. Dah that was a mistake. Had many seeds that did not sprout later. Just in aquarium hoods. And I used the daylight curved bulbs. The ones that might be 13 watt but like 60 watt. 2 in each hood' My hoods are the old ones that used light bulbs not tubes. It worked for me

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      Thanks for all the info. I will make sure my hood still works, may have to buy/make a new one. I will enjoy having a mini pond on my sun porch this winter!


      Quote Originally Posted by RCPing View Post
      They just died over time. Maybe l should have grown more seeding. Instead I stored them dry. Dah that was a mistake. Had many seeds that did not sprout later. Just in aquarium hoods. And I used the daylight curved bulbs. The ones that might be 13 watt but like 60 watt. 2 in each hood' My hoods are the old ones that used light bulbs not tubes. It worked for me

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