• Amused
  • Angry
  • Annoyed
  • Awesome
  • Bemused
  • Cocky
  • Cool
  • Crazy
  • Crying
  • Depressed
  • Down
  • Drunk
  • Embarrased
  • Enraged
  • Friendly
  • Geeky
  • Godly
  • Happy
  • Hateful
  • Hungry
  • Innocent
  • Meh
  • Piratey
  • Poorly
  • Sad
  • Secret
  • Shy
  • Sneaky
  • Tired
  • Results 1 to 8 of 8

    Thread: Two Issues

    1. #1
      keeper22 is offline Junior Member
      This user has no status.
       
      Feeling:
      ----
       
      Join Date
      Jul 2016
      Location
      Los Angeles
      Posts
      2

      Two Issues

      Hello all,

      I have a backyard pond and although this is just a hobby for me I want to take the best care of my fish as possible. We built our pond ourselves after a lot of research on forums such as this. It is roughly 2000 gallons with an aerator and I have 11 fish about 12-16". The skimmer and bottom drain (no pebbles) both go through multiple matala mats then up through a uv light and in the the waterfall box that has two layers of mats as well as bio balls. The perimeter of the pond is made of limestone so my ph is high but very stable. I do regular 10% water changes.

      I have two separate questions:
      I have a Doitsu Kohaku that has recently developed a few black spots. As I said earlier I just enjoy having the Koi and I am not trying to enter any shows or competitions. If the black spots is just some color coming through from bad gens that is fine. I just want to be sure that it is not a parasite or something negative that could affect my other fish. I have also included a picture from when I first noticed it a few months ago

      Name:  20171008_181421.jpg
Views: 126
Size:  99.0 KB
      Name:  20171008_181511.jpg
Views: 117
Size:  65.1 KB
      Name:  20171008_181540.jpg
Views: 122
Size:  70.2 KB

      Here is the pic when I first noticed
      Name:  Screenshot_20170609-142901.jpg
Views: 119
Size:  38.2 KB

      Since I got the equipment ( large net, small air pump, and holding bin) to take out the first fish I decided to look at another fish I was worried about. I believe this is a Sanke. I purchased this fish from a friend and when I got it I saw dome damage to the scales. He told me that it tried to jump out of the bucket and hurt himself. Being the rookie koi hobbiest that I was/am I took him at his word. I had noticed that the mark has not only not healed but seems to have got worse. The dark red in the rough patch from the pictures does not seem to be a wound but actually red coloring. The rough patch is quite rough but the fish seems to be un-affected by it, at least to the layman. It is my most aggressive eater, my quickest grower, most social, and sadly my favorite . I know that does not mean it is a healthy fish but it also doesn't hurt.

      Name:  20171008_182205.jpg
Views: 118
Size:  94.0 KB
      Name:  20171008_182207.jpg
Views: 118
Size:  89.2 KB

      Here is the pic of when I first got it
      Name:  20160928_073400.jpg
Views: 116
Size:  30.5 KB


      Thank you for any insight you can provide.

    2. #2
      RichToyBox's Avatar
      RichToyBox is online now Administrator ~ WWKC BOD ~
      Koi Health Care Committee Member
      This user has no status.
       
      Feeling:
      Awesome
       
      Join Date
      Feb 2005
      Location
      Sandston, VA
      Posts
      12,524
      On the first fish, that is called a shimi and it is genetics. Not good, but nothing harmful. The second fish, you describe the area as rough? Do you mean it is rough feeling, as in sandpaper? If so, that is usually an indication of parasites, namely costia, which consumes the slime coat, leaving the fish feeling like sandpaper. To rid the fish of the parasites, use a product called Proform C for 3 treatments daily, and add Prazi to the third dose. The Prazi, powder form, does not like to wet, but will wet with the Proform, so that is the reason for adding it at the third dose.

      And dose the entire pond, as the parasite is mobile.

      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."

      Zone 7 A/B
      Keep your words sweet. You never know when you may have to eat them.
      Richard

    3. #3
      koiman1950's Avatar
      koiman1950 is offline Senior Member ~ Koi Health Care Committee Member
      is semi retired
       
      Feeling:
      Tired
       
      Join Date
      Feb 2008
      Location
      San Jose, Ca
      Posts
      19,442
      That does look like an abrasion. how long have you had this fish? It appears to have grown quite a bit from when you got it. Also, the colors have drastically changed as well. BTW, this fish is known as a Showa. The wound does look worse than originally did and some type of treatment needs to be done, possibly a dip in one of the treatments available. Rich can probably suggest something to help.
      Mike

      check out our website at: http://www.pond-life.net



      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."

    4. #4
      keeper22 is offline Junior Member
      This user has no status.
       
      Feeling:
      ----
       
      Join Date
      Jul 2016
      Location
      Los Angeles
      Posts
      2
      I will take the shimi as good news for our pond, maybe I will change the name of the fish to Marilyn. As for the other guy. It seems like a crinkly harder layer over it's scales, almost like I could scrape it off. I am not sure if I should qualify it as sand paper? I have had it for almost a year, here is another picture of when I first got it.

      Name:  Attach1153_20160926_070930.jpg
Views: 104
Size:  45.8 KB

      I have not ever observed any kind of scratching behavior from the fish. Is there any detrimental effect of the parasite treatment? Meaning if I put it in the pond and that is not the issue will I create more issues for myself? On a side note about the change in color, from what I have read the limestone from my pond can often make the color "fall out" of the fish. I feed them Hikari-Gold in hopes of trying to counter act the color lose but I would love some other advice. I am in a So Cal so wintering is not something I have to take into account much.

    5. #5
      RichToyBox's Avatar
      RichToyBox is online now Administrator ~ WWKC BOD ~
      Koi Health Care Committee Member
      This user has no status.
       
      Feeling:
      Awesome
       
      Join Date
      Feb 2005
      Location
      Sandston, VA
      Posts
      12,524
      The parasite treatment is not a problem. If it is not that, I don't know what it could be. The fish should have a nice layer of slime coat as protection from bacteria and parasites, and the slime coat is what makes a fish slippery to the touch. I know of nothing other than parasites that will destroy the slime coat for any period of time. A roll outside the pond will remove it, netting can remove it, and some treatments can remove it, but all of those will regenerate pretty quickly, unless a parasite keeps it chewed off.

      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."

      Zone 7 A/B
      Keep your words sweet. You never know when you may have to eat them.
      Richard

    6. #6
      nmtsaki's Avatar
      nmtsaki is offline Senior Member ~ Koi Health Care Committee Member
      is hating changing her status yet
      again.
       
      Feeling:
      Cool
       
      Join Date
      May 2007
      Location
      Oak Park, MI
      Posts
      15,738
      Welcome to Koiphen! I hope you stay on after your issue is resolved. You have come to one of the best places for health advice as many members here have gone through something similar, or exactly the same.

      A couple of questions:
      Any other fish have it? (I may have missed this)
      when you say it's quite rough, is that looking, or as Rich said, did you actually touch it?
      Can you take a picture from the side? Costia usually also shows a notched nose, and the fish is dehydrated. They're usually not vigorous.
      Does the rough patch look waxy in any way? It's so hard to tell from a picture, but when I blow it up, it almost looks fungal or like carp pox. Are there any other areas on the fish that looks like it may be forming these patches? I can partially see the skin under it, which makes me think that something is growing ON it.
      Do you have access to a microscope where you could take a sample, or have someone else take a sample and look at it to see what it looks like under the microscope?

      Whatever it is, it is definitely not normal, and I would go over to my friend's house and look at his fish, because they're probably going to have it too. If it's viral, it may just not be as evident on his fish, maybe just a dot or two. I doubt he sold it to you knowing it had this, as it's not evident in the younger photo. Or if it is, it's starting on the tail to the posterior end, which makes me think viral. Also, in the younger photo, the fish's tail is a bit red, maybe just stress at the time, or the beginning of whatever issue is coming on.

      Further questions: can you give us actual numbers for your pond parameters:
      Ammonia, nitrIte, KH ( i'd like to see what that limestone is doing to it), pH, and NitrAte. Any salt in the pond?

      Sorry so many questions, but the more that are asked, the closer you get to a solution, and you have more background information to go on.

      Thanks, I hope it's figured out,

      Nancy


      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."






      Favorite Quotes:
      The greatest pleasure of a dog is that you may make a fool of yourself with him, and not only will he not scold you, but he will make a fool of himself, too. -- Samuel Butler.

      My little dog - a heartbeat at my feet. -- Edith Wharton.

      I think dogs are the most amazing creatures; they give unconditional love. For me they are the role model for being alive. -- Gilda Radner

      Yesterday I was a dog. Today I'm a dog. Tomorrow I'll probably still be a dog. Sigh! There's so little hope for advancement. -- Snoopy

    7. #7
      koiman1950's Avatar
      koiman1950 is offline Senior Member ~ Koi Health Care Committee Member
      is semi retired
       
      Feeling:
      Tired
       
      Join Date
      Feb 2008
      Location
      San Jose, Ca
      Posts
      19,442
      Nancy

      I took this segment from the OPs original post:

      " I purchased this fish from a friend and when I got it I saw dome damage to the scales. He told me that it tried to jump out of the bucket and hurt himself. Being the rookie koi hobbiest that I was/am I took him at his word. I had noticed that the mark has not only not healed but seems to have got worse.

      Personally speaking, I don't buy the story as this malady is now roughly a year old! It does look like some sort of fungus or viral issue. I've never seen anything like this that lasted a year without becoming all consuming and end in death. it's quite a weird situation.
      Mike

      check out our website at: http://www.pond-life.net



      "Our goal is to assist with emergency and Koi health issues, as well as educate on best practices. Please help us gain a clear picture by giving the original poster time to answer our questions before offering opinions and suggested treatments."

    8. #8
      GloriaL's Avatar
      GloriaL is offline Senior Member
      is YADA YADA YADA YADA WWKC Life
      time Diamond Member
       
      Feeling:
      ----
       
      Join Date
      Jul 2006
      Location
      Knoxville, Tn
      Posts
      4,741
      Just my two cents, but I would pull the fish out, anesthetize it, and take some good pictures. Then I would clean it with Betadine (won't hurt, may help). I had a fish with something similar that I scraped off and sent to a lab and it came back Carp Pox. I had scraped all the lesions off and treated with Betadine, triple antibiotic ointment and Denture powder. The underlying Beni disappeared but the pox has never come back.
      GloriaL
      YADA YADA YADA YADA WWKC Life time Diamond Member # 10












    Posting Permissions

    • You may not post new threads
    • You may not post replies
    • You may not post attachments
    • You may not edit your posts
    •