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    Thread: Koi with crooked back

    1. #1
      cottagefog is offline Senior Member
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      Koi with crooked back

      So back in July I bought this nice looking Ochiba. He swam normal. Looked normal. Then he disappeared deep into the pond and didn't see him for weeks. I thought he was gone. Just like the sock you loose in the dryer. Suddenly I started to see him. Just for a second and then he was gone.

      A few more weeks passed and I didn't not see him. Never came up for food. Never ever socialized.

      Finally got to see him again but I knew something wasn't right this time.

      I could tell he was swimming but not using his tail for any momentum. I caught him two days ago and has a severe angle to his back. Not quite the letter "Z" but that's the shape he is heading. Seems to be eating and "swimming" the best he can. SO from what I read there isn't much I can do?

      No other koi have this issue. I have felt around what pumps are in the water so I am not thinking any electrical issues.

      Let him go back in the pond and let him live happily ever after?

      Thanks for any insight

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    2. #2
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    3. #3
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      So, first, we need some info. Are your pumps IN the pond, like in submersible pumps? Where are they located? In a skimmer or on/near the floor of the pond? Did any of them fail/break during the last 3 months?
      Mike

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    4. #4
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      I would also ask in addition to Mike's question, are you on a GFI outlet that is functioning? If so, were there any recent trips?



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    5. #5
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      Interesting cottagefog. One of our mutual friends Greg Messler has a fish with a similar issue. Perhaps he would be able to give you some insight.

      Doug - out
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    6. #6
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      Most of the cases of broken back that I am familiar with are associated with lightning. Have you had any strong electrical storms since you put the fish in the pond, or last saw it swimming normally? I am not aware of any treatments that have worked to correct the broken backs, so like you say, it is what it is.
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    7. #7
      cottagefog is offline Senior Member
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      I have one pump that is submerged in the water. It is located in the skimmer box. Yes it is plugged into a GFI. No recent GFI trips. No GFI trips since the koi was introduced.
      We have had our share of thunderstorms. Nothing close enough that I know of that would have me thinking it was a lightning strike.

      I have pictures on my phone. I will try to post pictures next. I have two that show the deformity.
      Stay tuned.

    8. #8
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      Name:  koi 1.jpg
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      He is about 7 inches long. I tried to get the best pictures possible to show the deformity.

    9. #9
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      I would lean towards lightening. It hit my property and I can map out its damage through the electrical and cable in the house to show how the current traveled. It may have hit a tree, ground, etc in the area and just traveled until it hit resistance.



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    10. #10
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      Quote Originally Posted by jimfish98 View Post
      I would lean towards lightening. It hit my property and I can map out its damage through the electrical and cable in the house to show how the current traveled. It may have hit a tree, ground, etc in the area and just traveled until it hit resistance.
      My thought as well, but how would it only affect one fish. Wouldn't they all be "out of sorts"?

      Question for Cottagefog:

      What are the white and clear tubes in the pond? Looks interesting, just wondering?

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    11. #11
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      Hi Doug. The koi is in a 100 gallon aquarium. When I initially caught him I wasn't sure what his issues were until I could examine him in my "hospital" tank. Those white tubes you see are from the under gravel filter.

      I have a two story house and a 40 foot oak, and a 30 foot pine surrounding the pond. I also am skeptical that a lightning strike can weasel its way to the pond and only effect one single koi. I am not saying it couldn't happen, but it seems one in a trillion this could be the cause.

      My experience with a lightning strike. About 6 years ago my neighbor actually saw a bolt of lighting hit my front yard. What it did was fried four tv's in back of the house! Having three kids in the house at the time I had 7 active tvs. The tvs in front of the house weren't fried. The strike also followed every Cat 5 cable and smoked all the modems in the computers.
      I had an extension cord running across one downspout. It had melted and fused itself to the gutter. also located in the back of the house. All my damage was done to the back of the house though she saw the lightning bolt hit my front yard.

      So with that said, I wont totally disagree it wasn't from an electrical strike? Mother nature can leave you scratching your head?
      Last edited by cottagefog; 10-18-2016 at 08:05 AM.

    12. #12
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      Cottagefog, there are several threads on here dealing with lightning and koi. I have a yamabuki that was struck several years ago when lighting traveled underground. She was the only one affected. Doing fine now. But she swam "crazily" for a long time.


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    13. #13
      jimfish98's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by trumpetdoug View Post
      My thought as well, but how would it only affect one fish. Wouldn't they all be "out of sorts"? Doug - out
      While it has not happened with my fish, its a first in line scenario. When lightening hit my shed, it traveled and the closest wire was my line to the breaker panel for the pool/pond. It carried through the panel (with some charring) and split to the pool and pond. First thing on the pool line was the pump which was shot, everything behind it (lights, pool heater, solar panel controls) was ok. The split on the pond was the same where it took out the first receptacle only, and the UV that was plugged into that. Plugged in after it was the pump and air pump, both unaffected. After that power line, it hit the cable line. It runs to my office, closest to the strike, and then there is the home-run line shortly after that. The line to the office took out the first thing it hit (modem) and then the first line off the home run was my bedroom and the tv went. Our phone line was next and the first thing on it was destroyed as well (home alarm system). Everything else on every power, cable line, and phone line was fine. I think I lucked out with the fish as between the pond and the hit is my pool with a giant screen enclosure. On the side next to the pond, there is a giant grounding rod for the enclosure. It may have helped. The impression I get from my experience is that something will take the mass of it, dissipating the effects down the line. This koi could have just been closest to the strike and took the blunt of the charge. The others may have been jolted a bit, but not to the same extent.



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    14. #14
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      Here's another angle (pardon the pun) to consider. Could high nitrates cause deformities? I have a friend who breeds fish and one of his koi in his tank developed a crooked back just like yours. His nitrates are always very high; I mean red colour on the API liquid test and from reading I can't help but wonder there is a cause and effect relationship.

      Name:  Nitrate-Abnormal-Deformities-in-Rainbow-Trout.jpg
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      https://www.ysi.com/ysi-blog/water-b...than-you-think

      It's a pretty interesting read anyway.
      Last edited by KoiRun; 10-26-2016 at 11:48 PM.
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    15. #15
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      I still wonder if it is some sort of vitamin deficiency that affect certain fish with a weakened immune system. The reason I say this is one of my friends has a pond that is 9k and is under a green house. He has had those fish for ten years now. He does water test and everything is fine. All of a sudden one fish came up with a crooked back. I asked him if the G-house had been hit by lighting and he said no. He had checked everything to make for sure because that is what he thought too. Then a short time about a month another fish came up with the same thing. He thought that he got a bad shipment of food, I said yeah, but it didn't affect the other fish! So that is what is making me think what if those two fish had a compromised immune system along with vitamin deficiency? I am probable totally wrong, but, if it was lighting wouldn't he have found some sort of electrical damage some where? And he didn't!





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    16. #16
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      Could just be a birth defect that gets more obvious as it grows.

      Cheryl

    17. #17
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      There are a few things that can cause this issue. Lightning, stray electrical voltage from pond equipment and genetic problems along with heart attacks causing muscle spasms. Those trout show an issue that is most likely due to overcrowding and poor diet. Genetics could have played a role as well, as koi are culled for deformities within the first 6 weeks after birth. Trout usually are not.
      Mike

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    18. #18
      koi kichi is offline Senior Member
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      I have 3 koi that were struck by lightening. I hope they will get better but for now they are swimming like snakes but still eating. I did loose my largest male. I think his size might have been the cause. He could not get off the bottom and I had to put him down because he got sores.

      I was glad to hear that some do recover

    19. #19
      Marc BC is offline Member
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      I have a 5 year old Asagi 23" that got crooked shape this summer. I know i had no electrical problem. I feed quality hikari food. All my other fish are fine . This is the first time in 7 year keeping koi that I have this problem.

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    20. #20
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      Here is an update on my crooked koi. He was doing fine, eating, swimming, and 2 days ago he lost all his color. Almost turned white. Then showed signs of something wasn't right. Laid on the bottom on his side. Breathing very very slow. Had to go to work, and when I returned he had passed. Hopefully I gave him 6 months of good aquarium life.

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