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    Thread: Fish breaches water often, blows bubbles out of gills...

    1. #41
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      OK...I'm starting to think this is more related to object physically lodged somewhere versus parasites -- just my thought...so, my plan will wait until September to consider getting this fish out for exam. Seems happy, aggressive eater, no other fish effected. Keep me posted on others that have this issue...and your findings...

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    2. #42
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      Quote Originally Posted by koiman1950 View Post
      I've seen several koi exhibit this behavior. Most of the time, it is when they are first released from the bag after shipment. Kind of like an equilibrium type symptom. Most usually get over it within an hour or two. Some may never get over it. I've seen fish, 3-5 years old, in Japan do this very thing. When I've asked about it, the breeder usually says it's oxygen transfer or swim bladder problem. Can both be linked, I think so. There are several reasons that can be attributed to this behavior, the least of which, if they are not having difficulty eating, would be attributable to something lodged in their "throat" or an infection. Now, Steve, if your fish is first shaking it's head and then porpoising like this, then I would be much more concerned about a parasite like flukes being involved.
      I haven't been keeping koi long enough to know anything, but the times I have seen flukes, the fish would spit food, pec fins were sometimes clamped, they'd
      flash pretty regularly, and I could see them via a s/s... this guy doesn't display any of those symptoms and I've yet to see any bugs.

      I pulled him again today and, although I didn't put him under, I check his throat and gills thoroughly and still saw nothing.
      --Steve



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    3. #43
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      Quote Originally Posted by koiman1950 View Post
      I've seen several koi exhibit this behavior. Most of the time, it is when they are first released from the bag after shipment. Kind of like an equilibrium type symptom. Most usually get over it within an hour or two. Some may never get over it. I've seen fish, 3-5 years old, in Japan do this very thing. When I've asked about it, the breeder usually says it's oxygen transfer or swim bladder problem. Can both be linked, I think so. There are several reasons that can be attributed to this behavior, the least of which, if they are not having difficulty eating, would be attributable to something lodged in their "throat" or an infection. Now, Steve, if your fish is first shaking it's head and then porpoising like this, then I would be much more concerned about a parasite like flukes being involved.
      Nice post.

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      Quote Originally Posted by DebiCraig View Post
      OK...I'm starting to think this is more related to object physically lodged somewhere versus parasites -- just my thought...so, my plan will wait until September to consider getting this fish out for exam. Seems happy, aggressive eater, no other fish effected. Keep me posted on others that have this issue...and your findings...
      Swim bladder issues is more likely as Mike has said. If they have something lodged they well pipe and shack there head. I gave Steve some information to help eliminate possibilities. And based on my own personal experience. It should not be taken as status quo. I have read about what Mike has mentioned and sometimes they get over it and sometimes not.

    5. #45
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      Quote Originally Posted by kdh View Post
      Swim bladder issues is more likely as Mike has said. If they have something lodged they well pipe and shack there head. I gave Steve some information to help eliminate possibilities. And based on my own personal experience. It should not be taken as status quo. I have read about what Mike has mentioned and sometimes they get over it and sometimes not.
      I thik I was posting at the same time as Mike did...didn't even read this...thanks....

    6. #46
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      I pulled my breecher again this morning and put him under... pulled both gills open and the only thing I saw was a teeny little
      notch out of them... didn't seem torn or anything, nothing I could see stuck. Scraped from the gills, vent, side... but saw nothing.

      I guess I've never really opened a koi's mouth and looked, and I tried to get a picture, but it was a little hard to hold his mouth
      open and try and snap a picture at the same time , but I found one on Google of what I saw, and hopefully this isn't a really
      stupid question, but what's white "bump" looking thing in the center of their mouths?
      I was thinking I'd found something when I was examining him, but now I'm thinking it's probably normal.
      Attached Images Attached Images  
      --Steve



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    7. #47
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      Steve, Deb, whatever happened to these gulping koi? My kohaku is doing a lot of gulping these days. I call it nipping the surface and blowing bubbles out the gills. Thanks.
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    8. #48
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      Most of mine still do this occasionally every spring and into summer. I've never been able to tell exactly why but I'm sure something
      is irritating their gills. I've scoped, done a gill snip, I've had a vet do both too and nothing. I've treated with Broad Spectrum
      (ProformC) followed up by Fluke-M... still the same behavior. I treated with BSDT for gill disease and that seemed to help for
      a short time but it might have just been wishful thinking because it didn't seem to last long. So I've just accepted it as something
      they "do". It's not constant and usually happens after they eat, but not always.

      So my only suggestion would be to double check the water parameters and watch for any other symptoms of bugs like flashing,
      isolating, and such... but beyond that I'd just monitor them and not panic.
      --Steve



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    9. #49
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      My largest female has been doing this off an on for over 10 years now. She will stick her head a little out of the water and gulp air, then submerge and blow it out her gills. It is quite variable in frequency. Sometimes, she will do it several times in a day. Other times, we may not see her do it for a month. But she does it much more than the other koi, and often when no one else is doing it. She does it more when the water is cold. Whatever it is, it certainly has not slowed her growth.

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      Thanks Matt and Steve, countless sleepless nights are saved, I'm sure, from reassurance from people like yourselves.
      Time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time. ---- Marthe Troly-Curtin

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    11. #51
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      Quote Originally Posted by KoiRun View Post
      Steve, Deb, whatever happened to these gulping koi? My kohaku is doing a lot of gulping these days. I call it nipping the surface and blowing bubbles out the gills. Thanks.
      Sorry for the delay in responding...lots of personal stuff going on and have not been logged in..unfortunately this koi died in July of 2016.......I feed my fish in the morning time...Bella “bubbles” was just fine swimming around being her bubbly self....and then I came home for lunch and she was floating At the surface of the pond. I It was really hot that year too.... I still do not know what happened to her and why she was blowing bubbles.

    12. #52
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      Sorry to hear your koi died, Debi. I have a doitsu that is breaching to the "waist" and then blowing bubbles on the way down. Eating great, no signs of any issues. This has been going on for about 1.5 months now. Parasite protocol happened on the pond earlier this season. My waterfall, which doubles as a giant bird bath, makes for a great fluke provider. lol Need to still pull for physical exam but saw this thread and though I would jump on.
      Andrea
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    13. #53
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      Quote Originally Posted by ademink View Post
      Sorry to hear your koi died, Debi. I have a doitsu that is breaching to the "waist" and then blowing bubbles on the way down. Eating great, no signs of any issues. This has been going on for about 1.5 months now. Parasite protocol happened on the pond earlier this season. My waterfall, which doubles as a giant bird bath, makes for a great fluke provider. lol Need to still pull for physical exam but saw this thread and though I would jump on.
      If the breaching and bubble blowing is isolated to around feeding time, the fish will get crumbs/dust/food particles in the gills and do the breach and bubbles to dislodge it. If it is occurring at other times, then look for parasites.
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    14. #54
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      Thought I'd revisit this one more time since I noticed a definite difference as soon as the water cooled and
      wondered if others with fish that breach like this see the same thing?
      It was like a switch... as soon as the temps started to drop and the water temp routinely stayed below about
      60*, the one fish that did this a lot stopped completely. It acts the same (normal) as it did when it used to breach
      and still eats fine although a bit less obviously than when the water was warmer... but still at least once a day.
      But never breaches now.
      It's been covered before but just to reiterate it, I've checked for parasites multiple times, checked it's gills, checked
      for obstructions, water pH stable (.3-.4 swing) and chemistry pretty normal and the fish acts completely normal in
      all other respects. I thought maybe it had to do with the food but still feeding the same (Blackwater) as I always have.
      Anyone else see the same thing with their "gulpers"?
      --Steve



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    15. #55
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      Steve - I pulled mine to the indoor QT. No breaching. Zero. WHAT IS THIS? lol
      Andrea
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    16. #56
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      Touching base on this again. Pulled this koi from QT to look her over and she had a very tiny ulcer right between her pectoral fins that I treated. Gills looked good and mouth was clear. She has not breached once since being in the basement QT. She spends a LOT of time just sitting on the bottom. Still eats fine and is fat like a heifer.
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    17. #57
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      Quote Originally Posted by ademink View Post
      Steve - I pulled mine to the indoor QT. No breaching. Zero. WHAT IS THIS? lol
      I missed your post from a month ago but I'm with you, I don't have a clue.
      I've not seen any fish breach as before but still have been feeding sporadically when they're interested.

      I have had others that did the breaching sit on the bottom during winter but contributed it to the cold...
      I did have one die of what I'm guessing was BGD since by the time winter was over and spring was in full
      swing she was in distress and when I pulled her, her gills already looked terrible and beyond repair.
      So if it were me, and I had them in a QT inside, I'd keep checking on their gills for any type of disease.

      --Steve



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    18. #58
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      Sounds like a plan! I was going to wait for about a week to give the small ulcer time to heal then I'll haul her out and give it a go! I'll keep you posted.
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      So far no breeching and blowing bubbles this year from my kohaku. Also much less flashing coming from my matsuba and yamabuki. They would have gone through this stage already by this time in previous years. The only major change I can think of over the winter is that I have not flushed any of my pressure filters and 2) a marked decrease in water usage. I really think the parasites gets into their gills when I flush these filters. Even though I 'clear' the water before diverting it back to the pond after flushing, parasites still manage to get through. This is what they are trying to clear. My kohaku is terrible at clearing parasites in cooler temps. She is such a princess.

      I have once put under a microscope a newly ejected scale from one of my koi and saw a crab-like parasite imbedded deep inside the slime coat. I sometimes find these crab-like parasites when looking at filter sludge under a microscope. This leads me to believe that it is natural for koi to eject infected scales if they cannot flash the parasites off. Or I guess some flash too hard and often that a scale or two are bound to come off.
      Last edited by KoiRun; 04-06-2020 at 09:13 AM.
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      I’m no expert but as I was stumbling around looking for answers for my koi’s breaching, I happened upon this bread. I read every post and it seems the koi are all gulping or breaching in warmer weather or warmer waters. As I understand it, cold water holds oxygen better than warmer water. Is it possible there’s not enough oxygen or the koi is just less efficient at extracting it and needs greater amounts?

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