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Thread: koizyme vs medzyme????

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    bass68 is offline
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    koizyme vs medzyme????

    Which is better?????
    ON A LONG ENOUGH TIMELINE, THE SURVIVAL RATE FOR EVERYONE DROPS TO ZERO.

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    If I had to use one I'd choose Koizyme.
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    why use either one... Bottled stuff = lower CFU's ..............change water, and clean the mechanical filter = lower CFU's
    the simplest explanation is usually the correct one......... Occams razor....

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    Good morning Graham,
    How often do you have to change the water? I am doing 20-30% change once a week minimum, sometime twice. I have Ultima II biofilter 10,000

    By the way, I lived in Toronto 30 years ago, got my Canadian citizenship and move to US 30 yrs ago.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nytwinskoi View Post
    Good morning Graham,
    How often do you have to change the water? I am doing 20-30% change once a week minimum, sometime twice. I have Ultima II biofilter 10,000

    By the way, I lived in Toronto 30 years ago, got my Canadian citizenship and move to US 30 yrs ago.
    I flush my 2 80 gal vortexes about evey 2nd or 3rd day so say 2.5 times a week so thats about 400 gallons. Then I've got a pita leak that I can't find that requires about 200 gallons a day so that's another 1400 gallons per week so they are getting about 1800 gallons per week on a 5000 pond. Without the leak they were getting about a 1000gals per week
    the simplest explanation is usually the correct one......... Occams razor....

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    I have used Koizyme for years. especially like to have it on hand when the pond is coming out of winter and the filters aren't completely up to full speed.

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    Thanks so about 36% water change per week without any medzyme or koizyme. Past 2-3 monts, I have been using Aqua Medzyme and Microlift weekly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by majederr View Post
    I have used Koizyme for years. especially like to have it on hand when the pond is coming out of winter and the filters aren't completely up to full speed.
    Not sure what your filters have to do with it...these products are nothing more than bacteria that out compete aeromonas and psuedomonas bacteria for the available nutrient in the water. Once they starve out the pathogens, they die back until the next dose...= a lower CFU levels. They have no nitrifying abilities and they are not sludge eaters.

    A water change and good housecleaning can save a lot of money
    the simplest explanation is usually the correct one......... Occams razor....

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    Have the sac 15 on that pond, but was told that when coming out of winter, at certain temps, that the bad bacteria can take hold if filters are up to full speed. My filters run year round, but temps drop to 45-48 during the coldest winter months. So you are saying I don't need to use the stuff at all. Water changes during the winter are tough in that pond, so I assumed that using the koizyme would help keep the bad bacteria in check. Now I am confused

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    Has to do with a koi's depressed immune system in spring, not the nitrifying bacteria. They are more susceptible to the aeromonas you mention, and Koizyme competes (and wins) with aeromonas for food. I can attest to what happens when aeromonas takes hold, as I lost some koi this spring. It's not that expensive, a little goes a long way. A gallon can last a year, as you only use 4 tsp per 1000 gallons. I, for one, will use it for that added insurance that aeromonas will not take hold of my pond and koi...I did not use it this spring, and paid for it...

    Quote Originally Posted by Graham View Post
    Not sure what your filters have to do with it...these products are nothing more than bacteria that out compete aeromonas and psuedomonas bacteria for the available nutrient in the water. Once they starve out the pathogens, they die back until the next dose...= a lower CFU levels. They have no nitrifying abilities and they are not sludge eaters.

    A water change and good housecleaning can save a lot of money
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    Aeomonas and Psuedomonas couldn't care less if the filters are just coming out of winter or are running 100%. If the cionditions of the pond are suitable for them.....ie: dirty; then they'll increase thier numbers, if the fish's immune systen is subdued as it generally is coming out of winter, they they'll take advantage of that. Aeromonas Alley has been greatly debated.........

    I can't remember the exact temps but Koizyme can't be used below 55* or 50* and then the dose has to be doubled, or something like that...it's not till summer pond temps can it be used at a regular dosing level...that could get expensive. At that point do a water change. If your pond is too cold to do a water change then the zymes are not going to help

    If you pond goes into winter with great water quality, no sludge or leaves, filters cleaned and the fish are healthy, then there is no reason why they shouldn't come out of winter the same way. Once the temps get down into the high 40*'s to low 50*'s then the fish are not eating and generating very little waste.

    For years my fish stayed outside..no food from the end of Oct to the middle of May, iced over for Dec, Jan and Mar and I never lost a fish or had bacterial problems.
    the simplest explanation is usually the correct one......... Occams razor....

  13. #13
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    Vicki expensive insurance......$150 for the sake of a water change and a filter cleaning

    This is off the Koi Kare web site....



    I have heard that water temperature affects the dosage rate. Is that true?

    A: Yes. Water temp does have an affect on the dosage rate. This is because the KoiZyme bacteria is not as active (or hungry) at the lower water temps. Here is the dosage rates for the various water temps:

    50 to 62 degrees -- Double the label dosage of 20ml (4tsp) to 40ml (8 tsp).
    63 to 68 degrees -- 1.5 X the label dosage of 20ml (4tsp) to 30ml (6 tsp).
    69 and above -- normal label dosage
    the simplest explanation is usually the correct one......... Occams razor....

  14. #14
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    Another layer to the onion...
    from what I remember Lymnozyme and koizyme are the same thing...Lymnozyme was the old name, but some backroom branding/contract crap made it so the guy that was Rattlesnake selling Lymnozyme renamed it Koizyme...
    And as I recall the "bugs" in both were just repackaged and watered down bugs from trout aquaculture. The reasoning behind accepting the watered dpwn version in the Koi world was that the trout were raised at very high stocking rates. That don't make sense to me as all a koi hobbyist would have to do was put less in his pond. But from a salesman point of veiw it makes great sense...especially in the world of drug trafficking.
    Heard it from reliable sources but it is just good hearsay, so don't put more into it than that unless others post.
    Last edited by lukef; 07-29-2011 at 01:42 PM.
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    Luke you are correct Koizyme and Lymnozyme are/were the exact same product, while I don't know, it's a pretty safe bet the Medzyme is the same bacteria also, just in a dry formula...spores....as for the orgin of the product I have no idea
    the simplest explanation is usually the correct one......... Occams razor....

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    OK, but I guess I am just a bad koi keeper as we are way overstocked waiting for the new ponds to be up and running. They go into winter all clean and no debris and I backwash as much as I can during the winter months as well as get a few changes in, but I just thought the koizyme would help them get through the spring a little more safely being they are bumping into one another out there

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